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spider_creations

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Hello I emailed Wayne about mantids and I ask it's there any way to get the regulations on mantids to change and he said this "

The regulations covering mantids has been revised after more than 20 years and will be going to the Federal Register for public comment any day now –we thought it might be published today.  I would encourage you to provide comments when that happens.  The revisions will strengthen the restrictions on mantids." so the public can voice there conserns about how stupid it is to have a law that keeps them from there hobby. I am sending another email on how hobbist or were hobbyist can tell there opinion

[SIZE=11pt] [/SIZE]

 
spider_creations said:
Bump this back to the top  :D
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This topic was already the top post in it's section since it was posted yesterday...

spider_creations said:
He sent the link over "

The Federal Register website has a process for commenting.

The Federal Register can be found here:

https://www.federalregister.gov/public-inspection/current

We will also publish a notice with directions for commenting on our website: https://www.aphis.usda.gov/aphis/ourfocus/planthealth
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Well after spending way too much time sorting through the 6 special filing documents, and 134 regular filing documents at the moment there, I can tell you there is nothing posted mantid related (perhaps in a week or two there might be). Most are unpublished documents, which have to be downloaded to be viewed, then the PDF documents must be loaded and scrolled to the Title/OMB/Summary page (which is page 2 or 3 typically) to see what it is even about.

The closest documents I found were for the Agriculture department (likely where the USDA will post it) for a Rural energy savings program/Tart cherries marketing/Rural coop development grants, Fish and Wildlife service department for endangered/threatened wildlife and plants in Montana, US Customs department for a customs broker the fee is $138 due February 3rd 2017.

Same for the APHIS/USDA link, nothing there related to mantids.

Even if they do finally post something to be viewed and commented about related to mantids, while of interest, it will get little if any response from mantid keepers I imagine.

After all they are trying to say non-native/non-naturalized mantids require a permit, but are wanting people to tattle on themselves by leaving comments - or at least write a opposition response to the USDA's current permit requirements which will then add the writer to a list of interest of regulated mantids... either could, even if unlikely, invite a visit by the USDA/law enforcement.

 
CosbyArt said:
After all they are trying to say non-native/non-naturalized mantids require a permit, but are wanting people to tattle on themselves by leaving comments - or at least write a opposition response to the USDA's current permit requirements which will then add the writer to a list of interest of regulated mantids... either could, even if unlikely, invite a visit by the USDA/law enforcement.
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Yep. When I inquired about a permit for displaying live non-native mantids at Bugfest I was informed I would have to indicate the source of all non-native mantids in my possession. 

 
Rick said:
Yep. When I inquired about a permit for displaying live non-native mantids at Bugfest I was informed I would have to indicate the source of all non-native mantids in my possession. 
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I remember reading that and wondering where such specimens could be purchased without involving others in the ordeal as the source. I see how it is like the idea of comments from the public about the mantid revisions, it holds many other possible ramifications as well (even besides the obvious ones).

Sadly even if they listed that any comments received would not be used against the person writing it, I would still trust them zero percent. Even if no one received a surprise visit from them, it would give them much more data to perhaps even secure more funding or other things, to further punish keepers or the hobby in general. :(

 
New news about this, Wayne said that if we were to provide proof showing that if they were released won't hurt the ecosystem. it could lead to them made legal to own without a permit.  

 
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Oh really? To make sure tell him if this is a trap or not, okay? I don't know if this is wise but some proof involves the fact that other than the Chinese, European, Mediterranean mantis being introduced in the ecosystem (and not really doing anything to anything, yes that includes tarantulas, assassin bugs, scorpions, and some other critters to some extent), either they (mantids) don't really establish themselves there (unless there like subtropical or temperate species) along with the fact that orchids and other very brightly colored species will likely die off in the ecosystem very quickly (birds and reptiles pick them off) due to the need for almost tropical conditions (only Hawaii and florida have the conditions for these species, but then again they are overrun with invasive snakes and roaches and stuff). Also many species' ooths need to be in tempatures of 70+ degrees and that they can't be kept cold (most parts of the country can get quite cold). I can provide more but that's all I have for now. I might be wrong too.

 
Also I don't know if this is correct or not but we import many species of ornamental plants (roses and the like) from other countries that have the same microbes as the insects do. 

 
KevinsWither said:
Oh really? To make sure tell him if this is a trap or not, okay? I don't know if this is wise but some proof involves ...
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The only proof that would be accepted/considered by the USDA would be from a independent scientific study done about exotic mantid species and their impact on the various US ecosystems. Everything else is considered nothing more than opinions and perhaps conjecture, and would not influence the matter.

At least he admitted they needed proof of the matter, so that makes any comments pointless and a waste of time for anyone who gets involved. :(

 
CosbyArt said:
The only proof that would be accepted/considered by the USDA would be from a independent scientific study done about exotic mantid species and their impact on the various US ecosystems. Everything else is considered nothing more than opinions and perhaps conjecture, and would not influence the matter.

At least he admitted they needed proof of the matter, so that makes any comments pointless and a waste of time for anyone who gets involved. :(
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Its like what Kevin said in his Moonlight mantids video, don't bring it to the USDA attention and you'll be fine. 

 
Jessie said:
Guys i found this

https://www.thespruce.com/exotic-pet-laws-1238565

@CosbyArt at least in wi we have no regulations on exotic animals. Thst would include these guys. Well not to mention wi is very cold. So they woulsnt survive. Check your state.
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What you are referencing has no legal bearing on anything, let alone mantids.

The site is a "better homes and garden" type site, as from their about us page, "The Spruce is a new kind of home website offering practical, real-life tips and inspiration to help you create your best home."

Either way the article you linked to does not mention mantids or similar invertebrates for any state I read (even under the generic terms of insects or bugs) at all. It also gives zero state or federal laws as reference to their other typical mammal related data, which makes it little more than opinion at best. It is merely a list of their interpretation from who knows what information they found. As such all the other MF topics you simply posted the link to in the Regulatory Issues section have been removed as well, one link in a single topic is more than enough.

The USDA APHIS is the authority on the matter of mantids in the US, but even they do not provide legal definitions to state or federal law statutes that apply to the matter. They use at best a general law about agriculture pests and claim it applies to mantids if pressed if a response. Nothing new to any of us for sure. ;) See their website for their interpretation on mantids as pets.

 
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