# Mantis substrate.



## Brandon

What is good substrate to use for mantids :?:?


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## Shadow Mantis

I suggest using moss as a substrate


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## Rick

I use moist spaghnum moss. About a half an inch deep. It comes in a dried "loaf" sold at big box hardware stores as orchid moss.


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## Arachnids

Hmm. Can you name what kind of hardware stores?


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## Rick

Big box hardware stores= Lowe's or Home Depot. They call it orchid moss.


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## Brandon

Thanks Rick for your help, Rick.


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## Johnald Chaffinch

would soil work well? if so would i need to do something with it every so often. like put a fresh load in?


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## Ian

I use eco earth. A kind of soil made from compressed coconut fibre. Its very clean, very easy to use and make into a moist medium, and works wonders for keeping up humidity. Oh, and also, it looks good  

Cheers,

Ian


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## Rick

I use the coconut fiber stuff for my box turtle. That stuff is very messy and sticks to everything. It also dries out fast. Honestly, I hate that stuff. Good thing I never have to clean my box turltes cage out.


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## Chimpy666

Coconut husk just molds up in a couple of days I only use it in Millies plant dish which she basicly feeds from and the rest is just the bottom of the tank.


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## Peekaboo

I've had nothing but good luck with the coconut fiber. I agree with Ian that it does make a good moist medium, but I mist twice a day due to how dry my area is.

As for mold, the only mold problems I have is with fecal matter and left over food. I haven't had the coconut fiber itself mold.


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## Reeves

In my experience coconut fiber products like Eco Earth mold very easily. I've had problems with it in my taratula enclosures.


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## Ian

Yeah...I wil say that. I had a very slight problem with moulding on them. But I found if they were kept constantly damp, it kind of illiminated the thick stuff.

Cheers,

Ian


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## Peekaboo

> I use moist spaghnum moss. About a half an inch deep. It comes in a dried "loaf" sold at big box hardware stores as orchid moss.


Hey Rick,

Do you ever have problems with feeders burrowing into the moss and hiding from the mantis?


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## Samzo

> I use moist spaghnum moss. About a half an inch deep. It comes in a dried "loaf" sold at big box hardware stores as orchid moss.
> 
> 
> 
> Hey Rick,
> 
> Do you ever have problems with feeders burrowing into the moss and hiding from the mantis?
Click to expand...

I've had that problem I think the only way around it is it to press it down and don't put too much.. even still if the cricket wants to hide it manages. :?


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## Ian

I had that probs with my chams, so what I started doing was putting the crix in a small cupm with a twig in. The chams would walk over to the cuo, and munch the crix as they were walking up and oof the twig. This stopped them from all hiding in the moss, worked a treat.

Cheers,

Ian


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## Brandon

Can I use rocks as substrate(non sharp ones) :?:I believe it holds in moisture.


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## Peekaboo

Hey Brandon, rocks aren't very absorbant, and therefore they don't hold moisture very well. Definitely go for either the coconut fiber or moss as suggested in this thread.


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## Brandon

Okay, but I've found two new substrates. Repti bark(holds moisture) and calcium sand(holds moisture). Are these good substrates?


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## Reeves

For most species I use peat, maybe with a little vermiculate mixed in.

I've had no problems with it. For species that don't require alot of humidity (Gongys, Popa) I use ESU Lizard Litter.


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## Samzo

calcium sand doesnt hold moisture well.. its sand


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## Arachnids

What about repti bark? It holds in moisture.


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## Rick

> What about repti bark? It holds in moisture.


Bark won't hold moisture well. Spaghnum moss is one of the best choices for mantids. It's cheap too.


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## PseudoDave

Go with the moss in my view, the sand may hold moisture but not in a good way, it'll just become a breeding ground for bacteria. Moss is good at what you need, is cheaper in the long run than any other substrate, is easily managed and to top it all off it just makes it all look nice...


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## Lee2k4

I am using this stuff http://www.faunology.co.uk/shop/customer/home.php?cat=293

Holds moisture very well, I do spray the tank lightly every other day, but the stuff gets everywhere when your trying to get a cricket out of the tank and the little bleeder is running all over the place.


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## Rick

That looks ok but will likely dry out quicky and be a pain come cleaning time whereas the moss can just be dumped right out.


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## Brandon

Won't the mantid's food hide under the orchid moss? I have found another substrate... desert blend lizard litter. Good substrate, or not :?:


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## Samzo

honestly stick with coconut fibre or moss..


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## Chris Dickie

I dont use a substrate, no real need


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## Samzo

i use paper towl if i know they arnt staying long


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## MantisSouth

I got some moss from Wal-Mart and it put it about an inch deep in the bottom of the cages.. but.. it dries out rather quickly.. even after soaking it. :?


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## Johnald Chaffinch

is their any way reusing moss?


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## Samzo

> I got some moss from Wal-Mart and it put it about an inch deep in the bottom of the cages.. but.. it dries out rather quickly.. even after soaking it. :?


was it spagnum moss? that keeps water for over 3 days for me


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## shalapnagog

Actually you can use expanded shale, it is rock that is very porous and absorbant. Many people use it for there bonsais (including me) that live in hot regions. I have had bonsai's left out in the hot florida sun 90F+ for

a couple days potted in only this rock no soil and they were fine.

It should work as a very good substrate that will humidify your cage for days and is much easier to clean than soil and moss. If you dont like the soil and moss route try this.

I bought this stuff for about $20 for a 25lb bag shipped, that was last year though I am not sure if there prices or bag sizes have stayed the same they mainly ship in bulk.

Here is the website: http://www.hayditesoilconditioners.com/Bonsai.htm


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## shalapnagog

Also you can put plants directly in this rock in your Mantid cage.

Make a Vivarium full of Bonsai's and Mantids, that would be an awesome sight. Just pick a tree that can withstand the conditions of your house (juniper, ficus, elm etc..) have it near a window with indirect sunlight. Most bonsai trees need the elements (wind, rain, sun, cold) some do not need much like the ones listed. You can use ivys, lucky bamboo (which is said to be poisonous to some animals if ingested) dont know about Mantids but since they dont eat plants it shouldnt be a problem.

The expanded shale is the only rock that I have seen that can do this.

Just keep it moist. Hope this info is useful.


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## ABbuggin

I love the shreded coco bark...I gat it in something close to "18 cubes them I will crush up what ever I need.


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## prozacwoman

What about using those thirstystone coasters that soak up water? If you wanted a particular look in your container, like sand, but that didn't stay moist enough, I mean. You could bury one of those in the sand or moss or whatever and it should keep it moist, right?

xo,

AJ


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## Rick

I'm telling you guys, the spaghnum moss that comes in a "loaf" is probably the best.


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## MantisDude15

well since i live in Arizona, i just got some really small rocks from my bakcyard, and put that in the box i keep my mantids in, put in a few dried sticks, and they look happy to me  the sticks make it easy for them to reach the top, where they are usually at. i mist daily, becasue the rocks dont hold water very well, but it looks good, and its not messy


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## OGIGA

Do you guys use dried sphagnum moss or live ones?


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## Peekaboo

Go ahead and use dried, they can easily be bought by the bag at nurseries. Just make sure to mist them once/twice a day, depending on how dry the climate is where you live.


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## OGIGA

Hmm, so no soaking or anything? Only misting?


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## Peekaboo

I like to give it a good soak and squeeze off the excess when I first put it in the enclosure, and I do the same whenever I change out the moss.


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## OGIGA

Ah, sounds like a good idea.

I just came back from Ace Hardware and they are selling then in packs of 7 liters for $5.79 or so. Is that a reasonable price or can I do better elsewhere?

Ace is also selling lady bugs ($7.99) and oothecas (probably Chinese) ($9.99/2-pack).


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## Rick

> I use moist spaghnum moss. About a half an inch deep. It comes in a dried "loaf" sold at big box hardware stores as orchid moss.
> 
> 
> 
> Hey Rick,
> 
> Do you ever have problems with feeders burrowing into the moss and hiding from the mantis?
Click to expand...

Yeah but it's not a big deal. They always come back out.


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## Peekaboo

> I use moist spaghnum moss. About a half an inch deep. It comes in a dried "loaf" sold at big box hardware stores as orchid moss.
> 
> 
> 
> Hey Rick,
> 
> Do you ever have problems with feeders burrowing into the moss and hiding from the mantis?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Yeah but it's not a big deal. They always come back out.
Click to expand...

Cool thanks Rick! One year and five months later .....


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## wuwu

better late than never.


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## Peekaboo

Yes I was just kidding around with him.


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## bubforever

> I use moist spaghnum moss. About a half an inch deep. It comes in a dried "loaf" sold at big box hardware stores as orchid moss.
> 
> 
> 
> Hey Rick,
> 
> Do you ever have problems with feeders burrowing into the moss and hiding from the mantis?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Yeah but it's not a big deal. They always come back out.
Click to expand...

What about for the nymphs, you have to feed them smaller food so wouldn't it be almost impossible for the mantis to find the food?


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## nepenthes_ak

What if i can get live moss to grow would that be ok?

Probably not sphagnum that takes allot of water, and peat too. (I might be up for it though) But common yard moss (I know its different but im talking the stuff you see growing in soil and on rocks (a generalization)?


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## OGIGA

Hmm, sphagnum has a lot more surface area so my intuition tells me that you're going to need a lot more of the other kind of moss.


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## nepenthes_ak

i can get sphagnum no problem (I grow Carnivorous plants) So its easy for me to get it its just the question could it get to humid?


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## captainmerkin

My first one is set up for young mantis (got a tiny orchid mantis in there now, but hes going back in a cup till bigger).

its 18cm by 18cm wooden base and roof, 3 sides netted with nylon mesh from worldwidebutterflies, and front side has double hinged door made of perspex, held shut with selotape for now.

Bottom edge is raised with wood and sealed with silicon sealant, then has around an inch of general purpose compost with a shade resistant fern growing there, fake flower bunged into it. Will post picture when I have internet at home again!


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## Rick

I have used a lot of substrates. The spaghnum has worked the best. With small mantids that eat fruit flies it's not a problem as the flies don't go under the moss. For small crickets I put a stick or something in there and the cricket will climb up to the top where the mantis ususally is.


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