# Shall we cross breeding Orchid mantis of different sources?



## Fisherman_Brazil (Jan 17, 2009)

Shall we cross breeding Orchid mantis of different sources? Please advise!

Specimens from Indonesia

















and, Specimens from Malaysia


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## hibiscusmile (Jan 17, 2009)

From what I know, eventuatlly you have to use difference source, otherwise they will become sterile. Rob will advise us better when he sees this post, he is pretty much the expert on Orchids. I just pm him, he will come and answer for us!


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## Rob Byatt (Jan 17, 2009)

hibiscusmile said:


> From what I know, eventuatlly you have to use difference source, otherwise they will become sterile. Rob will advise us better when he sees this post, he is pretty much the expert on Orchids. I just pm him, he will come and answer for us!


Away for the weekend, so will come back on Sunday


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## Fisherman_Brazil (Jan 17, 2009)

An young biologist here in Taiwan told me that they may be different more then we think, and may not be a good idea to do so! And certainly, I do not want to be stupid.


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## Fisherman_Brazil (Jan 18, 2009)

Curiously enough, I've found there are mating ritual, but never be able to mate! Are they really the same species?


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## dafke14 (Jan 18, 2009)

Luke i was thinking the same of Mantis religiosa, in Spain they have a white spot on the inside of the fore arms and the french one has a black dot but the rest is the same.

regards Dave


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## hibiscusmile (Jan 18, 2009)

:huh: Goodness,. it is so pretty, almost violet, or purple, I hope Christian or Rob can help!


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## Peter Clausen (Jan 19, 2009)

Two considerations that I see...

1. if you are going to keep them in the pet hobby (captivity), there is no harm in breeding them. In fact, the offspring will probably be healthier!

2. if you were going to mix the two populations, there might be enough interesting differences between them (on a genetic level) that it would be like "playing God" to release any of the offspring back into either of the two founding populations.

Even within consideration #2, the effect would probably be minimal.

I vote for healthy pets that remain in the hobby (and eventually die off like most captive cultures of orchid mantises anyway). Go for it!


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## Rob Byatt (Jan 19, 2009)

hibiscusmile said:


> From what I know, eventuatlly you have to use difference source, otherwise they will become sterile. Rob will advise us better when he sees this post, he is pretty much the expert on Orchids. I just pm him, he will come and answer for us!


Really, there are people that know far more than me ! B) 

I would say they are likely to be the same species. There are three species in this genus; _Hymenopus coronatus, H. coronatoides and H. biconis._

_H. bicornis _ is from China, so we can discount that one. The other two are going to be very similar as they were made synonymous in 2002, but are still listed as distinct species. Both are found in Indonesia. I have never seen _H. bicornis _, but I presume, due to the species name, that the protuberance on the head is split in two at the end.

It may be a good idea to not breed them just to be on the safe side, but instead to find pairs from the same region.


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## Morpheus uk (Jan 19, 2009)

Found a pic of a male Hymenopus coronatoides if it helps or just out of curiosity,

http://www.7c.gov.cn/color/DisplayPages/Co...?contentid=8529


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## Fisherman_Brazil (Jan 19, 2009)

more picture of the two

Indonesia











Malaysia


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## kamakiri (Jan 19, 2009)

They look similar enough that I would try it. Unless there is a precedent that says otherwise, I feel it would be worth it to try.


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