# Violin care



## Colorcham427 (Mar 22, 2011)

I have sold a ton of L2 and L3 Violin mantis nymphs and even pre-sub and sub-adult pairs in the past few months.

In case some of you bought some else where, I would like to share my care-sheet that I provided for my previous buyers who I wasn't positive if they were new or not to the hobby or Violin species.

Here it is:

If you need any help let me know. This species is extremely easy to get every nymph to adult!!!  

Only mist them once a day, light mist.

I started doing something different with my mantids that has helped them a lot.

My mantids' 75 watt lights go on at 6 A.M. If you can't do this early enough, invest in a timer, they are worth it!!!

I feed them early in the after noon, around 1 p.m. In EVERY mantis cage I keep two shallow cups with something for them to climb onto. The water dish is just a small, shallow container filled with water and I place some wood chips in it so they have a surface incase they fall into the water! LOL they will drown if the wood chips aren't there! The second small shallow container has a few pinches of sugar/powdered butter milk. 50/50 mix ratio. I only sprinkle a few pinches because this powdery mix hardens within 12 hours, so I only offer the flies enough for them to eat.

If you want, you can ALSO fill ONE shallow container with a tea spoon of honey and 1/4th of a cup of water. Mix it well! Then add a few pinches of sugar and stir it again. Then pour into the container and place in the cage(s).

I feed them their flies before it is TOO HOT for the flies to thrive in. Flies do BEST IN 75-80 degrees. Once it gets higher than 85 degrees, all the flies do is hang around the water source and they don't fly around and stimulate my mantids, because they are over heated and MUST rehydrate themselves constantly.

Once it is around 2 P.M. and the flies are eaten, I then raise the temperature by having my 250 watt bulbs turn on. The 75-80 degrees is raised within an hour to 100 degrees for my Violins and other 100 degree species' section.

I mist their cage around 6 P.M. with only one light spray, make sure it is a very fine mist, no dense drops! Their lights automatically shut off at 8 P.M.

For Violins, you can use butter fly net cages from livemonarch.com (lowest price) or thin holed screen or plastic mesh cage. MAKE SURE to set-up the cage with dried twigs from outside. I pick out twigs and thin branches all the time outside in my yard and near by wooded area/bike path. Make sure to pick out the kind of tree branches/twigs that are very bumpy with lots of crevices. NO smooth surfaced bark!  

I pre-heat my oven at 300 degrees and then put the branches and twigs on a tray and place them in the oven for an hour. It smells good and the bark gets very dry and some of the pieces of bark on them tends to curve out a little which is good for the mantid's claws' grip!  

It's important to kill whatever is living inside the bark. Parasites are tiny!!!

Violins need good ventilation.

If you are keeping the Violins in a room with high humidity due to other species, you should invest in a small fan and have it flower around their area in the room.

Do you have any other species? Any questions or concerns, just ask! I am an email away, thanks!

Not sure if this is the best thread for this section but thought I'd share my care sheet? Thanks all for helping me out with my over stock of Violins!!!


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## alicenwnderlnd (Mar 22, 2011)

Good Information!


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## d17oug18 (Mar 22, 2011)

i like what i see, good caresheet! i dont do all that but its a very nice idea. I may get timers now =P


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## PhilinYuma (Mar 22, 2011)

This is well done, Brian, and I'm not sure why it hasn't earned more responses yet, perhaps later in the evening. I think that anyone who followed this would do fine, but I have a couple of minor questions, not as points of disagreement but as discussion

I suspect that my Yuma houseflies have a higher heat tolerance than yours. The rule of thumb that I use for "HFs having a good time" is 30C or 86F, though they get pretty drowsy outside in summer afternoons when the temp is 110F or higher. What kind of RF do you have in yr bug room, and what do you use for humidification? Mine has always been pathetically low, often below 10%, and I have just started experimenting with ultrasonic humidifiers for the past few days. I wonder if it is not high humidity with the heat that causes trouble for the flies. I assume that you keep the gongies at about 50%RH?

No problems with the fly food, though you might try adding a little baker's yeast, and we've all had the problem of solidified powdered milk, but I wonder why you go to the trouble to feed them at all, since they are only in the gongies' cage for a few hours before being eaten. One very simple way to feed HFs in their own cages, BTW, is to stir up yr powdered milk and yeast in honey and just splurge it on the top of the net cage. The flies will eat it through the mesh and clean up every drop!

The normal daytime ambient temp for me is 85F and it's not hard to raise that to 90-100F. Lamps are great for directional heat, but what are you going to use when the last of the incandescents are phased out? I could stockpile ten year's worth of floods, I guess, but I would be very pissed if I died when they were only half way through  

Finally, I wasn't sure about what yopu do to kill possible parasites. Do you think that the oven treatment kills everything? I doubt that it would kill mites, but I'm not sure.

Anyway, nice job.


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## sporeworld (Mar 23, 2011)

Great job!

In the spirit of contribution (not disagreement), I'd say I had temps tended to stay in the same range, maybe a bit higher (100-103 degrees f). Also, I had crazy humidity (80%) from a fogger on one brood, and just daily spraying in another, and it didn't seems to matter.

I had them in cages, and they had no problems crawling around on the screen (but i think y'all are on the right track with the thin branches everywhere). And same as you, all my heat and light are on timers.

I never really noticed if they had a prefered feeding time, but that's pretty interesting. Mine learned that tapping on the top meant I was dropping in flies. I think they also began to anticipate that visitors (spectators) meant flies were on the way.

As I've mentioned before, I love Gongy's! Gentle, graceful giants!


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## JoraMajora (Mar 23, 2011)

I love this useful caresheet. Thanks for putting this together


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## Rick (Mar 23, 2011)

You know me I have to make suggestions. Neither of the dishes are absolutely necessary. However, if you feed too many flies for the mantis to eat quickly a food source for the flies isn't a bad idea. I assume that is what your second dish is for. I simply feed the flies well before putting them in with the mantis. I keep one bulb on them that gets them up to at least 90 in a live monarch net cage. Mist at least once a day and feed bluebottle flies. That's it. Like many members I applaud your experimenting and finding what works for you, but others should know that some things are not always needed to make it work.


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## animalexplorer (Mar 23, 2011)

Thanks Brian for this fantastic post, and yes, the violins I got from you are doing great!


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## Colorcham427 (Mar 28, 2011)

Thanks Paul!

Phil,

What is this acronym "RF" that I have yet to add to my Mantid pool of knowledge in my young brain!? lol...

I have many Pathos plants inside my room for my Furcifer Pardalis. The plants are watered daily, Pathos are almost impossible to kill, they are so darn hardy! I mist their plants a few times a day. They also have "drip systems". These droplets of water are hitting several leaves of their plants, so there is a build up of water in their Pathos' soil. I have water collectors under the cages that are used for collecting the water. These water collectors end up being soaked paper towels in a container which are cleaned, and of course new paper towels are replaced daily. My Panther chameleons breathe better with 40+ humidity. Inside their cages it sometimes gets to 60% but lately I try to keep it around 40 - 50%.

To maintain such a steady, precise and consistent temp/humidity level in a room, one has to have lots of money! That's like one giant incubator! lol.. All aspects of keeping exotic animals is a constant "trial and error", at least in my house! I always come up with new ideas to make things easier for myself, while keeping my animals as comfortable as possible.

I have an electric heater in my room which remains at 73ish. If I close my door during the day the ambient temperature would sky rocket to around 100+ which could kill my Panthers and possibly hurt some of my other Mantid sp. If I leave the door open all the way during the day, the ambient temperature would settle at a range of between 70 - 75 degrees. If I leave the door half way open and night time, it can get to a nice 66-69 degrees. My future of keeping my animals comfortable will become easier!  I will soon turn the very large room in my basement into a chameleon room, a long with other similar climate species of whatever I end up with!  My present room (much smaller room) will have a closed door to keep the hotter sp. thriving!  

Oh Phil, by the way, powdered buttermilk is annoying!! lol!! The powdered buttermilk tends to harden within hours, and that is hard for the flies, even though their "fly acid vomit" helps, it really doesn't "cut it" for those little turds!  I've been mixing it all up and pouring a few tea spoons daily to loosen it up. It makes it into more of an island of "sugary mud" with some sugary water surrounding it. The aspen fiber is always resting on top of the dish just in case one of the little turds falls in they have something to help them get out! hehehe.. As for the honey ceiling Phil, I try my best to prevent laundry washer time for the net cages. When I clean my net cages I bleach them and with using a deadly chemical, I let them dry out for extra days before using again.

If any one of you has trouble maintaining humidity, I strongly suggest investing in a few Pathos plants! You can make several cuttings and in no time, have a ton of Pathos plants! These plants root without any issues, they don't need anything special to help them thrive. Just soil, water, and something to keep them in! Keeping a large amount of plants or even a large bucket of soil really wet, will help raise the humidity level. You could also section off a corner of the room with a shower curtain. You could even decorate the shower curtain to make it look nice, and hopefully it wouldn't stand out in an awkward way!


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## dgerndt (Mar 29, 2011)

Great care sheet! It's good to see another person contributing to making care sheets! I recently (well, not so recently anymore...) posted a miomantis paykulli care sheet. I hope others follow along and make care sheets of their own to share.


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## Ricardo (Mar 31, 2011)

Nice! I'll be using this every so often seeing as I'm raising four violins!  

Im keeping them in the furnace room because its nice and warm in there, around 85


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## Colorcham427 (May 20, 2011)

Nice!!!! Thanks all


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## PhilinYuma (May 20, 2011)

Brian: I'm glad that this thread came back. I hadn't read it all after the care sheet. My "acronym" "RF" is a typo for RH, relative humidity! When I use honey, I use very little and smear it thinly on the top of the net. The flies clean it up without leaving a trace. I agree about powdered buttermilk, but I have similar problems with powdered milk. I now make a slurry of powdered milk, honey water and active yeast , soak it up with a piece of sponge -- the type that we make bungs from -- and let the flies feed off that.

BTW, I think that what you call Pathos are Pothos, aren't they?


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## Termite48 (May 20, 2011)

Brian: I like your Violin care sheet. I hope to incorparate most of the ideas within a week or so. Right now I am letting the soda bottle BB fly apparatus produce flies as they will and allow the mantids to have access at all times to what ever is being produced by the bottle at the bottom of the cage like Kiet's set up. I get it that these temps are for ideal growth, but what is you are wanting to prolong the life span a little. I understand that as long as the metabolism is working, one can lower the high temps to more like in the low 90s. Is this true?


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## Colorcham427 (May 21, 2011)

Yes it's true Rich. Lowering the temp. will slow them down. They'll eat less. FYI - Your male will not be old, and he will get the job done, I assure you that!  

More time seeing them a live is always more pleasure for me, these are our pets!


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## Colorcham427 (May 21, 2011)

PhilinYuma said:


> Brian: I'm glad that this thread came back. I hadn't read it all after the care sheet. My "acronym" "RF" is a typo for RH, relative humidity! When I use honey, I use very little and smear it thinly on the top of the net. The flies clean it up without leaving a trace. I agree about powdered buttermilk, but I have similar problems with powdered milk. I now make a slurry of powdered milk, honey water and active yeast , soak it up with a piece of sponge -- the type that we make bungs from -- and let the flies feed off that.
> 
> BTW, I think that what you call Pathos are Pothos, aren't they?


Pathos.. shmathos.. lol I honestly had always spelled them Pothos until I was corrected and now am just... at a loss since I am too tired to google it now.. lol, I bet you're right though!

I've used many methods, right now the method I am using is neat and easy to maintain and clean up.

I am going to start putting 50+ BB pupae in a water bottle, when they hatch it would be a lot easier letting them climb out rather than fly out! lol... It's annoying going back and forth to the fridge! lol.. even though my fridge is less than 15 feet away from my alien room!


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## masonperillo (Jul 2, 2011)

i have 2 livemonarch cages but wont the extreme heat burn the mesh off?


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## Termite48 (Oct 1, 2011)

I have placed a flood light for heat, right next to the mesh of the Monarch cage and the mesh does not even get singed. I measured the temp at that distance at over 140 degrees. So I think there is little to fear of a flash point in these temperature ranges that are put out by our 65 Watt. Perhaps a different story would be the case using a 250 Watt, which I have, but seldom use except in winter to over come a ten or more drop in ambient temp.


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## ShieldMantid1997 (Oct 1, 2011)

What i do is have them (3 L4's) in a 12" net cube, with twigs, and kept at about 100 degrees give or take a degree. I put flies in and it's done! I keep them at 80-86 at night, is that right? Or should i just cut the heat and let it drop to 72 degrees? also i mist them once a day but with the net cubes i feel like the moisture just leaves right away, and doesn't even give the mantises humidity?


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## psyconiko (Oct 1, 2011)

Gongylus can complete their lifecycle without a single drop of water and a 40 to 60% humidity level.


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## Psychobunny (Oct 4, 2011)

ShieldMantid1997 said:


> What i do is have them (3 L4's) in a 12" net cube, with twigs, and kept at about 100 degrees give or take a degree. I put flies in and it's done! I keep them at 80-86 at night, is that right? Or should i just cut the heat and let it drop to 72 degrees? also i mist them once a day but with the net cubes i feel like the moisture just leaves right away, and doesn't even give the mantises humidity?


I have a big problem with low humidity in the winter.

The solution is a good quality humidifier (the cold vapor kind).

The home heating dries the air.


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## Skylineblinkfan (Oct 4, 2011)

My wife loves it very cold in our home, it stays around 75/74 during the summer and Around 77 in the winter. And all of my mantids seem to do great without any additional heat source. I have a presub adult female violin, a pair of adult carolinas, 2 L3 popa spurca, 6 ghost, and 1 lineola. With our home being so cold all summer, it has extended my violins life i would say. It has been almost 4 months since her last molt. She even has a healthy appetite, she never skips a single day of feeding. She usually eats 2 crickets a day, and somtimes 2 to 3 moths.


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## ShieldMantid1997 (Oct 8, 2011)

Scarby said:


> My wife loves it very cold in our home, it stays around 75/74 during the summer and Around 77 in the winter. And all of my mantids seem to do great without any additional heat source. I have a presub adult female violin, a pair of adult carolinas, 2 L3 popa spurca, 6 ghost, and 1 lineola. With our home being so cold all summer, it has extended my violins life i would say. It has been almost 4 months since her last molt. She even has a healthy appetite, she never skips a single day of feeding. She usually eats 2 crickets a day, and somtimes 2 to 3 moths.


i used to keep them at 73 and it would take them two months to molt, now they are at 99 degrees and molt every and month or three weeks.


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## psyconiko (Oct 9, 2011)

Psychobunny said:


> I have a big problem with low humidity in the winter.
> 
> The solution is a good quality humidifier (the cold vapor kind).
> 
> The home heating dries the air.


They do not need high level of humidity,They can be fine at around 40% without a single drop of water during their lifecycle.


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## Skylineblinkfan (Oct 9, 2011)

Well the humidity where i am right now is at 92%. And it usually stays pretty high.


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## psyconiko (Oct 9, 2011)

Yes they can also stand high level of humidity.No problem.


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## SilentDeviL (Dec 5, 2011)

Nikkko said:


> Yes they can also stand high level of humidity.No problem.


Damn the only Problem is Canada don't sell any types of fly insect other then FF's..... lol Or I would of Order some Ootheca from you Nikkko


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## Psychobunny (Dec 16, 2011)

My 2 nymphs L4 and L5 seem to be much happier since I transfered them to a 12''

net cube and gave them an overhead heat lamp.

Seems like they really like all that room to be happy!!

Before, they were very jumpy and would run around, like nervous.

Now they are calm and just hang happily from the top of the cube all day just being mellow


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## lunarstorm (Dec 16, 2011)

Glad to hear it! Good job on moving them to the netcube.


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