# Mesh Enclosure for Idolo



## sporeworld (Dec 8, 2010)

So, I'm pretty new to 3D stuff (and curves are really frustrating), but here's a rough attempt to illustrate what's on my planner for an Idolo enclosure. I'm looking for suggestions, criticisms, ect.

Plan is to make the first model out of wood and entirely cover the interior object (a "Molt Tower" maybe?) with loose-fitting mesh.

Fixed lighting and Repti-fogged will hang from above. Feeding ports added as needed.

Possibly designed with the Molt Tower mounted to the bottom with struts, and the whole thing sitting in a pan for lift-and-clean access (think rabbit cage).

An alternative would be to just run a ledge all the way around the outside to accomplish the same thing - namely, more horizontal space with vertical climbing surfaces within reach. If the prevailing thoughts are that thin twigs are better than nylon mesh, the surface could be covered with bamboo matts or similar blind-like sheets. Or wicker or something.

Thoughts...?


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## Rick (Dec 8, 2010)

I am not sure about a molting tower for any mantis. It seems it would just put the molting platform closer to the floor which is the last thing you would want. The underside of the lid serves the exact same purpose. And if the mantis molts from the lid, the molting tower might pose a hazard. My suggestion would be to remove the tower and looks like you will have a quality cage.


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## sporeworld (Dec 8, 2010)

What I'm trying to do is (A) increase the total horizontal surface area and ( B) provide a safer landing for falling mantids (like a safelty net). Alternately, I may just hang vines from the top of the enclosure to the bottom, which would only minimally reduce the walking area on the top, but would provide vertical climbing area within reach. I'm essentially doing that now my putting potted plants inside - same outcome.

The back-up plan is to just build a 7 or 8 foot frame, mesh it, and fill it with twigs.


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## warpdrive (Dec 8, 2010)

I know that you won't listen to my advice after your lambasting of my thoughts on care that I gave to a newbie, but I'll be brief...

No,no, no, and NO. Don't do anything that you are thinking about doing even if the room's humidity levels are high.

Sorry I didn't have enough time to PM you last night. I'm doing it now and will explain why I'm saying the above.

Harry


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## warpdrive (Dec 8, 2010)

I know that you won't listen to my advice after your lambasting of my thoughts on care that I gave to a newbie, but I'll be brief...

No,no, no, and NO. Don't do anything that you are thinking about doing even if the room's humidity levels are high.

Sorry I didn't have enough time to PM you last night. I'm doing it now and will explain why I'm saying the above.

Harry

Edit: I'm having probems with pop ups on my blackberry but if you send me a PM first I know I will be able to reply with my phone number.

Or PM Precarious and he can give you my 1-800 number and I turned off the caller I'd so I won't be able to see your phone number.


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## Colorcham427 (Dec 8, 2010)

Hey man,

The wide holed (soft fabric) mesh is a necessity for my L3 and bigger Idolos under my roof.

I am still looking for the perfect substrate as a softer fall and something that can stay damp but not harden once it dries. Cotton is plane old dirty once one poop gets on it, it spreads like no other...  

For the tower, I have never tried it. It doesn't rub off on me in a positive way though. I would love to hear success stories from you using it though.  

Sorry to type a lot of stuff up, but this is important to me that I share my experience.

My BEST advice that I can give to people who are keeping Idolos:

L1,L2 nymphs - (Butter fly net cage) No substrate. Just a small cup of house fly pupae, small cup of house fly food mixed with water and then mixed with a piece of paper towel so the flies don't get stuck in it. I mist the cage, not misting the nymphs directly, twice a day. (5-6 sprays).

L3,L4 nymphs - (32 ounce deli cup container). 1 nymph per cup. I glue a one inch strip of paper towel on one side of the cup with non toxic glue, so the Idolo can climb back up to the Mesh. It is not wide enough for the Idolo to be comfortable on. Never had one molt on the side from having such a narrow wall of climbing material. (Molting on the side of the container is a precarious way to attempt molting for medium sized nymphs.) I cut out a huge circle out of the lid, only keeping enough plastic to allow it to click in and lock. I then hot glue a wide holed soft fabric mesh on the inside of the lid. I use one half a sheet of paper towel paper and wet it, and then press it down to the bottom of the container. I mist the paper towel twice a day, 10-12 sprays each time.

If you have a ton of L3, L4 nymphs, you could definitely use the method that I use for the L5 + sized nymphs.

L5 + Are placed in a wide holed soft mesh hamper, meant for small loads of laundry. Hot glue the sides with non-fragrance garbage bag so they cannot climb, and so you can keep a lot more humidity in there. Make sure they only have enough paper towel strips to use them for climbing back up. The bottom is filled with enough paper towel to make a 4 inch layer. I don't press it down, I let it sit up and remain fluffy and sloppy. I mist the paper towel twice a day, 12 sprays each time.

Success rate has increased dramatically.

I sold all of my small and medium nymphs due to not having enough in my opinion. Once I get the chance to buy 70-90 L1 nymphs is when I will try this again.

Starting off with 80 on average L1 nymphs would be a great start for a promising count of perfectly shaped adults.

Hope to see more and more CB nymphs in the US.


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## warpdrive (Dec 8, 2010)

Brian Aschenbach said:


> Hey man,
> 
> The wide holed (soft fabric) mesh is a necessity for my L3 and bigger Idolos under my roof.
> 
> ...


I can't agree more with what Brian is saying as I'm reading and hearing through the grape vine the same things.

I am willing to try what I call the Precarious method named after the forum member's way he is dealing with them as I have similar temps and humidity and think that it will work even better for you in the end.

I do wish you luck with them regardless of what you might think of me.

I hope all goes well for you in the future with them as they are worth the trouble and we need more like you willing to try new ways to help us newbies learn.

Harry


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## hibiscusmile (Dec 8, 2010)

I think it is a good idea, but also agree with Rick. Nix the tower, and instead, maybe use frame upon frame to make a step like area all around, meaning if it was on the bottom, make a platform 3/4" tall and maybe 3" shorter in area, and then another one, so one would be like going upstairs, but upside down, this way they can stay on top, but at diff levels. and I think either the mesh u mentioned or the stuff u ship them with would work for the top.

Let me also say to all  that everyone who thinks you can save an idol by having a soft place to land if they fall is not realistic. They are soft and no matter what they fall on it will deform them, the way they molt is how they will turn out, if not enough room, then they are crooked, they do not have it in them to fall and straighten theirselves out.


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## sporeworld (Dec 8, 2010)

Darn! I've seen other (smaller) species recover from a fall. Was hoping it was doable with these guys... sigh...

Great suggestions all around. Especially the narrow climbing area - might make me revisit a glass enclosure.

I'll keep putzing (and posting).


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## sporeworld (Dec 9, 2010)

Was this what you were suggesting, Himantis...?






Something like this would be kind of fun if I slipped plexiglass between the modular peices and separated them for cleaning, molting and such. I'm only semi-serious about this, but maybe there's some value in experimenting.


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## Rick (Dec 9, 2010)

The tower is a bad idea for any species. I see what you're trying to do, but you don't really need anymore surface area. Unless there are many mantids in there you will have plenty of space. I'd go with vines or something else instead of a tower like that. It will cause more problems and not really get you to your goal. Falling mantids during molting are pretty much doomed unless you witness the fall and can help. Even that is no guarantee.


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## sporeworld (Dec 9, 2010)

Part of the idea is to provide more horizontal surface area without using more flat space on my shelves. I'm pretty sure Precarious has the solution, and this is just putzing (which is WAY more fun than just copying the answers off HIS paper). But I'd love to stumble on something in this exercise that's worth while.

I'm sure we can engineer something more precise - even if it's just to find the best way to ARRANGE the twigs and vines.

I really like Precarious' bamboo ceiling idea. So maybe instead of a tower or ledges on the sides, I hang platforms from the ceiling - like constructed vines.

Is there anyone else out there that likes to putz with this kind of stuff, or is it just me being nutty...?


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## hibiscusmile (Dec 9, 2010)

nice pic, but no, just ment if you took like a shoebox lid and then another that was a couple inches smaller and glued to the first one and so on, you would use the ceiling as steps that they could each hang onto.


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## sporeworld (Dec 9, 2010)

I see.

Well, I may try some different approaches for fun. I saw a design for a yurt (Mongolian house) that had potential. I may also just make a bouquet of bent coat hangers and adhere cocnut fibers or something to them - see if there's a "perfect" arrangement.

I have a half-baked idea to have a hanging, dome-shaped wicker-like cage, with a glass bottom and hang it above my desk. Then just unlatch the bottom for a quick dump &amp; clean. I've been looking at bird cages for inspiration, too. Some interesting hanging examples.


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## Krissim Klaw (Dec 10, 2010)

I think the tower would be unnecessary but I would really be curious to see how these mantises far in a wooden/wicker/some sort of cage with very textured structure. Seems from what other people have posted on these mantids they can often hang on to sticks even when they have problems with mesh.

Personally I've always wanted to get a large wooden oriental style cricket or bird cage one day to use as a decorative mantis cage. They are so pretty.


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## sporeworld (Dec 10, 2010)

Krissim Klaw said:


> Personally I've always wanted to get a large wooden oriental style cricket or bird cage one day to use as a decorative mantis cage. They are so pretty.


Ex-ACT-ly!!!

There are obvious challenges, like flies escaping through the cracks, but probably solutions as well (like net-bagging the entire enclosure overnight for feeding).

Of just take the mantids OUT and putting them in seperate feeding enclosures when appropriate (that's what I did when I had turtles to keep the tank clean).

Fun, fun, fun!


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