# Stagmomantis limbata (?)



## rbird (Jul 29, 2015)

Ok, here she is. Stagmomantis limbata? Found her in Los Angeles.

(Edit: better pics scroll down.)





She molted within days after I found her (after eating ff like crazy.) I waited a day after her molting then tried to feed her ff again. She couldn't catch the ff any more, she kept missing them, I'm thinking it's because she grew so much bigger and then the ff were too small to catch? or too soon to feed after molting? I was surprised how much she grew.





These were quick pics but I don't have a macro lens to compete here! I'll have to hone my picture skills...


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## PrayingMantisPets (Jul 29, 2015)

Might be a Stagmomantis limbata, or a stagmomantis californica. Im not so sure though, im not too familiar with those species.


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## CosbyArt (Jul 29, 2015)

It could be both - seems soon after molting they have to get use to their larger size (especially when catching small flies). Could be the smaller flies are too small now as well. How large is the mantid now? May be time to move up to larger Hydei ff or house flies.


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## mantisman 230 (Jul 29, 2015)

She is much too large for fruit flies! Feed her crickets moths and larger flies, as she is a presubadult.


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## rbird (Jul 29, 2015)

Definitely needed bigger food after molting. I fed her up with a honey bee and some flies I caught outside. She ate them dead when I offered them to her with tweezers!

I bought some crickets until I get something better like a house fly culture, etc.

She's about 1 1/2 in. now.

Thanks


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## Danny. (Jul 29, 2015)

rbird said:


> Definitely needed bigger food after molting. I fed her up with a honey bee and some flies I caught outside. She ate them dead when I offered them to her with tweezers!
> 
> I bought some crickets until I get something better like a house fly culture, etc.
> 
> ...


No need for crickets just keep feeding flies.


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## rbird (Aug 3, 2015)

This is the "Before" molt pic from Sunday, she molted last night, "After" molt pic coming Tuesday.

I'm leaning towards Stagomantis Californica since this molt. Once she dries out for a day, I will take another pic and hopefully it'll show the brownish color change that I see on her body.


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## rbird (Aug 4, 2015)

Ok, Tuesday, "after" molt pic here;

With the brown coloring now I'm thinking Stagmomantis Californica ?





Anyone have a male ?





What do you think?


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## Jay (Aug 4, 2015)

Great find, Rbird!

My thought is, once she is adult and calling, take her back to the area you found her (at night) in some kind of net cage and wait for a male to appear.


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## MantidLord (Aug 5, 2015)

Looks like S. limbata to me.


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## rbird (Aug 5, 2015)

MantidLord said:


> Looks like S. limbata to me.


Ok, I'm back to S. limbata too ha, ha.

I don't see a turquoise upper lip but she's not an adult yet either.

I got the lip id info. from this link;

http://mantidforum.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=31194


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## rbird (Aug 5, 2015)

Jay said:


> Great find, Rbird!
> 
> My thought is, once she is adult and calling, take her back to the area you found her (at night) in some kind of net cage and wait for a male to appear.


Good idea and easy enough to try since she was found in my yard.

(I saw another mantis weeks earlier but I was off to work and didn't have time to catch it.)


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## rbird (Aug 18, 2015)

S. limbata it is! ... I think...

Based on the blue upper lip. (pics appear "washed out" on my screen.)





Looks like a blue lip to me... ? What's it look like on your screen?





She's a darker tan and brown than these pictures show.





...





...





At first, I thought these 'Ninja' moves were angry or defensive ones... nope, just cleaning up after eating.


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## rbird (Aug 18, 2015)

opps... double posted...


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## MantidLord (Aug 22, 2015)

rbird said:


> Good idea and easy enough to try since she was found in my yard.
> 
> (I saw another mantis weeks earlier but I was off to work and didn't have time to catch it.)


Unfortunately this isn't a full proof method to determine the species if that's what you were trying to do by luring males to her. In several species of mantids, there have been instances where female calling has attracted heterospecific males. So you could end up attracting both californica and limbata males (if they're present and are attracted/detect the signal).

That said, I'm even more certain it's limbata.


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## mantisman 230 (Aug 22, 2015)

There will be a huge size difference between the two species, S. californica is the smaller of the US Stagmomantid species. S. Limbata is the largest, and the males are unmistakable.


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## rbird (Aug 23, 2015)

If all goes well, we'll see what she attracts when an adult and calling.

Here's a size reference for her;





All these recent pics are better representations of her color. Especially the yellow-ish appearing on, what I believe is, her Mesothorax.





...





...


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## Jay (Aug 24, 2015)

Hmm... In all my years of living in Arizona and seeing S. limbata many times I never have never seen a female that was not green. And Arizona (especially the Tucson area) tends to be incredibly dry! Not to disagree with anyone and not to say that other morphs cannot exist, but just saying...


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## Danny. (Aug 25, 2015)

Jay said:


> Hmm... In all my years of living in Arizona and seeing S. limbata many times I never have never seen a female that was not green. And Arizona (especially the Tucson area) tends to be incredibly dry! Not to disagree with anyone and not to say that other morphs cannot exist, but just saying...


Mine started off green and turned a light brown when adult.


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## MantidLord (Aug 25, 2015)

Okay...despite everything Ive said. Those last pics by rbird remind me a LOT of the S. californica that I had. In fact I was comparing that green coloration to my californica at the time which were a brownish-grayish color around that instar. In fact I'm willing to say without a doubt yours are S. californica. Looking at the pronotum width and abdomen shape, it has to be californica and not limbata.

Again, checking to see what males she will attract is not a good indicator (see previous posts) but it is a good method to find POTENTIALLY suitable males. As I only got a crack at this species once, I really hope you can mate them and hopefully make them more common in the hobby


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## MantidLord (Aug 25, 2015)

Sorry to double post, but I'm on my phone and trying to add pictures to show why I'm sure it's S. californica. Hopefully they attach...

The ruler picture is a (horrible quality) of my female who looked very similar to rbird's female. The other picture is of her when she was L2


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## rbird (Aug 25, 2015)

She had a hard night... she molted and I found her this morning on the ground. Her body is bent a little. Right eye is damaged. She has wings!





She was cleaning her legs (3 functioning well) so her mouth is working but she's in rough shape. Doesn't look good.


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## Danny. (Aug 25, 2015)

FUBAR... Poor thing


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## MantidLord (Aug 25, 2015)

I'm having a bad couple of days. And I know I've flip flopped. S. limbata. Californica wings are black. The lime yellow is indicative of limbata.


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## Jay (Aug 25, 2015)

I am so sorry about the wings. I wish you the very best with her!


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## rbird (Aug 26, 2015)

*Day One: Post Molt Crash *

A _crucial_ hurdle passed; she attacked and ate a honey bee this morning! (Loaded with pollen no doubt.)

Really a desperate and mangled body but she's active and ate a bee looking like that! Amazing!

(I'll put her down if I think it's the right thing to do but not yet.)





Here you can better see her damaged "one eye." Hopefully, it doesn't get worse... seems unchanged so far.





She ate even with that curve in her body... poor wings but so what?... abdomen doesn't appear damaged.





Hopefully she'll live and start "calling" in the next few weeks? We'll see...


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## rbird (Aug 28, 2015)

She's incredible! Look at her stand up compared to the previous pics. What a difference a couple of days makes.

I'm more confident she'll not only survive but thrive and mate.





She now uses all 4 (bent and curved) rear legs to stand and hang upside down again.





She's not the perfect specimen any more but what or who is anyway?





I'm sure she'll "call" when ready.


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## mantisman 230 (Aug 28, 2015)

well done so far!


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## cat_named_noodles (Aug 29, 2015)

Jay said:


> Hmm... In all my years of living in Arizona and seeing S. limbata many times I never have never seen a female that was not green. And Arizona (especially the Tucson area) tends to be incredibly dry! Not to disagree with anyone and not to say that other morphs cannot exist, but just saying...


We had a brown S. limbata female last year, but we're in central Texas.





This year's S. limbata (should have ooths in a couple weeks)


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## cat_named_noodles (Aug 29, 2015)

Good luck with her rbird. I hope she breeds for you!


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## rbird (Sep 3, 2015)

cat_named_noodles said:


> Good luck with her rbird. I hope she breeds for you!


Thanks, I'm hopeful she will. So far so good. The eye appears stable, she's active, etc. She's eating like crazy!

Enjoyed your limbata pictures- mine has that light brown/tan color too.


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## rbird (Oct 7, 2015)

No luck with her calling yet (as far as I can tell.)

About 5 weeks since adulthood. The caresheet says about 3 weeks into adulthood and they are ready to mate. (I assume mantids will mate if placed together but the female won't necessarily exhibit obvious calling behavior to attract a mate? I guess all kinds of behavior are possible.)

Hoping she'll call, I've been leaving her outside but it is getting cooler (65 F) at night and we've actually had some rain in Los Angeles lately so I've brought her inside.

I leave her outside during the day most days. Well see...


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## CosbyArt (Oct 8, 2015)

Glad to hear she is hanging in there. The wings are no issue, but I'm amazed to hear she is able to use her legs.

Regarding her calling for a mate, I've noticed several of my females don't do it, or at least I was unable to catch them. They did however mate successfully with males I introduced to them and have since laid ooths. Likely she is doing it really late at night after you went to sleep for the night, or simply releasing pheromones without the usual active call look. Best wishes finding a male for her, after all she's been through, it would be a shame for her ooths to be infertile.


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## rbird (Oct 10, 2015)

*She attracted 2 males last night ! *_Yeah ! ha, ha !_ if she eats one I still have another Yikes _!_

This is the larger male, greenish, hard to tell in the pic but as long as her, if not possibly longer.





(Both males are very active, crawling and flying around so, hard to get closer and

clearer pics outside their enclosures.)

The smaller male also greenish. He's a _little_ more calm.





After feeding her a bunch of flies I tried to mate her with the smaller male.

To soon I think, he's too active and aggravated being in an enclosure at this point to mate

Close up of the larger male cleaning his antennae.


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## rbird (Oct 10, 2015)

*Things are moving fast since this morning !*



After reading Rick's sticky on mating mantids I used my bathroom, with it's screened window for space, to mate the larger male to her.

Presto, within seconds, Rick's advice worked like a charm !

She now has a honey bee to keep her occupied.


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## CosbyArt (Oct 10, 2015)

Congrats, glad to see she did get some males.


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## rbird (Oct 11, 2015)

Thank you CosbyArt

It's especially cool to me because she's my first plus she's a survivor.


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## rbird (Oct 15, 2015)

*She laid an Ooth ! *





Interestingly, one rear leg was dried into the Ooth and I had to pull it out. (not shown in pics)





* I know this is "old hat" for many of you folks but this one is mine ha, ha.


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## rbird (Nov 3, 2015)

*She laid her second Ooth.*

But she is either very exhausted or dying? (A rear leg was caught in the dried Ooth again.) She's barely moving though still alive at this point.

Update: She passed away this afternoon.


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## Deacon (Nov 14, 2015)

rbird,

Sorry you lost her but she really was a survivor and you did a fine job getting her so far that she laid a couple of ooths. I hope you get get nymphs.


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## rbird (Apr 11, 2016)

Limbata Ooth hatched today! About 2 dozen so far. My first hatching


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## mantisman 230 (Apr 11, 2016)

Fantastic


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## CosbyArt (Apr 11, 2016)

Congrats on the hatch! It is always nice to see new nymphs


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## rbird (Apr 12, 2016)

Thank you guys it's really cool ha ha!


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## Sarah K (Apr 12, 2016)

rbird said:


> Limbata Ooth hatched today! About 2 dozen so far. My first hatching


Congrats!!!!! Can't wait to see my first hatch! it will probably be Carolina from the ooths I got from Thomas!


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## CosbyArt (Apr 12, 2016)

Sarah K said:


> Congrats!!!!! Can't wait to see my first hatch! it will probably be Carolina from the ooths I got from Thomas!


So far from the Carolina ooths I recently sold/traded/gave away, I have heard of luckily only one that had parasitic wasps (I really hate those wasps), and of one little Carolina nymph hatching from another. Thus they should be ready to make an appearance soon.


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## rbird (Apr 12, 2016)

Sarah, with good luck and hope you'll get some! These little nymphs made my day... small hatch of 29 total.

*Day 2:* No further hatchlings. 2 casualties. Lots of ff eating last night! (Phew, I don't have springtails.) Today I misted the habitats with a little distilled water.

I split them into 4 homes so they aren't overcrowded; nymphs, ff jumping and running like crazy everywhere. It was quite a circus show...


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## Starving Always (Apr 12, 2016)

Whoo!! I know the EXACT feeling when i myself had my first hatch ever!! it was awesome i had to record it XD i totally agree with them being a circus show. they are super wild and have so much personality. youd be surprised how difficult and how much time i had spend making sure they were safe and well. i split them in 4 containers too!! it was a griffin ooth and it had to hatch over more than 80+. i noticed my nymphs to be super thirsty after they emerge from the ooth until a couple days after, so be sure to mist them LIGHTLY occasionally. best of luck to your baby mantises!! 

involving the stagmomantis sp., i used to find MANY females at this local park in the shrubs. and it was near the basketball court, so there were tall lights, and id find the males flying out and about. in fact, they were the species that got me here today! me, my dad, and mantises helped introduce me to the praying mantis hobby. that was many years ago. i didnt see any (during the fall). i might have to check again as the heat is starting to kick in in Los Angeles. i really hope to see some more at my local park so i can get them for myself and breed in captivity. from what i remember, they were very agressive, can be varied in tan, green, or light green, and have leaf-like wings.


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## rbird (Apr 17, 2016)

*Total 42 so far. *

Yeah! first hatch is especially great. I haven't lost many to escapes or casualties either... "knock on wood."

They're eating both M. ff and D. hydei too (!) a little misting with water.

Doing well at this point.


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## Hisserdude (Apr 17, 2016)

Very cool, it's amazing that you got your female to mate and lay two ootheca in that condition, she really lived her life to the fullest.  Hopefully her young will grow nicely for you, and hopefully her deformities were not genetic...


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## Sarah K (May 2, 2016)

CosbyArt said:


> So far from the Carolina ooths I recently sold/traded/gave away, I have heard of luckily only one that had parasitic wasps (I really hate those wasps), and of one little Carolina nymph hatching from another. Thus they should be ready to make an appearance soon.


One of my Carolina ooths hatched while I was away for 4 days (great timing, right? LOL) 16 so far....I am not sure if it is done yet, but I am still so excited! Thanks CosbyArt!


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## CosbyArt (May 4, 2016)

Sarah K said:


> One of my Carolina ooths hatched while I was away for 4 days (great timing, right? LOL) 16 so far....I am not sure if it is done yet, but I am still so excited! Thanks CosbyArt!


Yeah it happens at the worst times typically.  Glad to see hear you had some nymphs finally saying hello, your more than welcome.

I've had four Carolina ooths hatch so far, and they had 22, 29, 42, 56 nymphs from each. The large hatch I'm not sure how there was 56 nymphs, as the typical count is 20 to 40 nymphs a ooth - guess it was just a whopper of a ooth.


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## rbird (May 4, 2016)

Congrats on all the bugs, it's that time of year! but please start your own thread


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## rbird (May 4, 2016)

*Update @ L2 Nymphs: *the color lives on!

One of the nymphs is brown/tan like the mother. 






Most of the nymphs are a bright Green color like this one. Maybe they'll be more browns in later molts too?


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## CosbyArt (May 5, 2016)

rbird said:


> Congrats on all the bugs, it's that time of year! but please start your own thread


Yeah we do tend to get off track too easily on the forum.  



rbird said:


> *Update @ L2 Nymphs: *the color lives on!
> 
> One of the nymphs is brown/tan like the mother.
> 
> ...


Great to see they are doing fine.  

Regarding color it is said to be related to their moisture level, and decorations in their habitats. Although in all honestly it seems to be more hit and miss on coloring as I have both in the same setup myself.

With my Stagmomantis carolina nymphs they all tend to be brown as nymphs and slowly change over to green near adults, but I've found some wild colors on wild captured ones as seen in my mantid thread (near black females and interesting color variations, unlike anything I have seen in captivity).


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## rbird (May 6, 2016)

Sold and gave away a bunch so others can enjoy (and make my life simpler!) Down to 9 nymphs at this point.

With a future 2nd generation breeding season in mind I will pare them down to only females once their sex is determined. I hopefully can attract males locally again.+



CosbyArt said:


> Regarding color it is said to be related to their moisture level, and decorations in their habitats. Although in all honestly it seems to be more hit and miss on coloring as I have both in the same setup myself.
> 
> With my Stagmomantis carolina nymphs they all tend to be brown as nymphs and slowly change over to green near adults, but I've found some wild colors on wild captured ones as seen in my mantid thread (near black females and interesting color variations, unlike anything I have seen in captivity).


I wonder what the color change is for, in terms of survival? and does it depend on the time of year? 

I'm looking forward to any 2nd generation coloring surprises... we'll see and WOW those are really amazing colors on the wild Carolina's Thomas.


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## CosbyArt (May 6, 2016)

rbird said:


> Sold and gave away a bunch so others can enjoy (and make my life simpler!) Down to 9 nymphs at this point.
> 
> With a future 2nd generation breeding season in mind I will pare them down to only females once their sex is determined. I hopefully can attract males locally again.+
> 
> ...


Always nice to cull the hatch down to a manageable level when possible.  

Good idea to get more local male mantids if needed, can make the task easier as you are not having to worry about their aging/molting together and such. I would imagine the color changing is a forum of camouflage to better hide from potential predators, or to make it easier to sneak up on prey. Regarding the time of year affecting color I'm not really sure, but as they do tend to take on their local coloring if they don't molt to adults until late fall I imagine it would change their coloring compared to ones that molted earlier in the fall (when there were colorful leaves).

Thanks, yeah some of them were really unique in their coloring. I was surprised at the different ones I collect all from my small front yard. The ooths have been spread to many other members here, and I've had some hatch lately, so I'm hoping to see if anyone gets some unique mantid coloration as they age.


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## rbird (Nov 16, 2016)

Well I was disappointed that all my remaining S. Limbata Nymphs died and therefore my generational hopes were dashed. Not finding or having any mantids all summer. I finally got smart and put the word out to my friends to keep an eye open for Mantids before the season is over! They came through with flying colors! What took me so long to ask them? I might still get Ooths this season?






First, was this large green S. Limbata female found about Nov. 4, 2016 in Los Angeles. I suspect at this time of year she would be Gravid but she appeared thin to me? Maybe she already laid her Ooths? She wasn't very active and I couldn't get her to eat so after about 5 days I let her go.






Then, a friend in Charleston, North Carolina found a Stagmomantis Carolina. She wouldn't ship it to me in SoCal for fear of it dying! Arrgh! Close but no mantid for me! It's another beauty just the same.






Finally, was this S. Limbata beauty found in a friends garden on Nov. 11, 2016 in Los Angeles. She's perfect looking and eating like crazy. I am not sure if she is Gravid? but she's fairly plump so I'm hopeful. I left her outside for a couple of days in a ventilated habitat but no luck attracting males yet.






It's starting to get fairly cool at night (for Los Angeles at least!) in the 50's so I'm bringing her in. Hope she is gravid and they are fertilized? I'll post more info.and pics. Whatever happens she's a great looking Limbata in Camo colors too!











Seems it's late in the season around here? We'll see what happens.






She really is the perfect specimen. I can find no faults with her. Look at that wing detail...


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## CosbyArt (Nov 17, 2016)

@rbird Glad to see you found a way to find even more of them, glad your friends aren't too sacred to capture them (it happens haha).  

The first female was not gravid, and was in between ooths. How many ooths she had left if any though is hard to say.

Shipping with the freezing temps in the midwest and surrounding areas this time of year can be rough, especially for someone who has not done it before (and wouldn't have the heat packs on hand). Too bad though she wasn't willing to dig a bit into how to do it properly, and ship her then.

Your last female is indeed gravid and should be laying within the next 3-4 days at most. Hard to tell with the angle in the photos with her wings, but her shadow really shows off her abdomen making it obvious.  So best of luck with the ooths she will be laying for you.


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## rbird (Nov 29, 2016)

She laid one early this morning! Still fresh and greenish hahahah...







I don't know if it's fertile but maybe we'll find out in the spring?


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## Sarah K (Nov 29, 2016)

CONGRATS! Hope it brings you lots of babies! And if you ever want Carolinas, let me know. They are one of my faves, so I should have them most of the time in the future.


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## rbird (May 24, 2017)

And it hatched today! About 25-30 Limbata Nymphs so far:


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## rbird (May 28, 2017)

Now that I think about it almost 180 days or about 6 months WITH a natural outside diapause is a long time before hatching.


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## rbird (Jun 10, 2017)

_Eating fruit flies and each other like crazy! _ 

Gotta sell some to save some


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