# IM Done!



## PrayingMantisPets (May 12, 2015)

Last night i saw that my presub female African Twig Mantis was about to molt. So I sprayed her container and let her be. I got home and shes dead! She was hanging by one leg in the roof of her container. She did not molt but she is really really soft. I honestly do not know what happened. Once again I cannot breed my mantises! I keep trying and trying but i just cant mate them. Anyone know why she died?




What i failed to breed:
Chinese Mantis 
Miomantis biotata

Hierodula membranacea

hierodula majuscula
Pseudocreobotra wahlbergi (6 times!)
Deroplatys desiccata
sphodromantis gastrica
Idolomantis diabolica 
Stagmomantis carolina
Parasphendale affinis
Miomantis paykilli

Of course i have never breed a mantis before! They just drop like liquid!


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## LAME (May 12, 2015)

Misting to much prior to molt?

I don't spray if I see they're due for molts... But that's me.


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## Forcep (May 12, 2015)

You mist an African twig before molt and probably that's why. For more than half of the species in your list, they should be left bone dry. And for the rest Southeast Asian species, they can be easily messed up with low air humidity.

Just give any hardy species from dry habitat another chance and don't mist them at all. I've kept P. wahlbergi/ B. mendica and some other similar species from 1st instar without a single droplet of water (ooth still need moisture though) .


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## PrayingMantisPets (May 12, 2015)

None of them on my list had molting issues, they all died from various reasons, (molting, murdered by cat, blackdeath, etc.


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## SSimsswiSS (May 12, 2015)

Agreed with above. Too wet. Given your location to, in FL where it can be humid outside as well. This is a dry species. I only lightly mist once every three days while raising them up. And as adults they like a good drink about once a week, and like P. wahlbergii's get most of their moisture from their food/prey.


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## Aryia (May 12, 2015)

Misting is seriously over-rated. Don't listen when caresheets advise you to mist daily or keep high humidity at all times. It doesn't benefit the mantis in anyway and generally creates more problems. Constant high humidity is just asking for bacterial/mold growth and it creates a horrible environment for a mantis to live in. Imagine living in a damp room where you can't get your feet dry, ever? I mist my nymphs every 3-4 days, adults I mist every week. Sometimes I forget to mist them or miss a couple, nothing bad ever comes of it.

And "black death" as people call it, is literally just a mantis vomiting. It could be regurgitating extra liquid prior to molting (again, probably drank too much from getting misted too much?) or it could be vomiting because it's sick (bad food? or enclosure overrun with bacteria/mold from overmisting?)

Overmisting can cause molting problems too. It's not the magic cure for molting problems. Though keep in mind there are keepers that do have to mist daily, but only because their environment itself is bone dry.


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## LAME (May 12, 2015)

I completely agree with Aryia.


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## Precarious (May 12, 2015)

For the record, I mist every species I keep in the morning and again at night. Even supposed dry species. And I mist extra when a molt is coming. I hate to disagree with members I respect as proven breeders but I seriously doubt misting caused any issues in this instance.

Some species, however, are very sensitive to being disturbed prior to molt. Popas are skittish in general so that may be the cause here. If a nymph feels threatened or unsafe it will sometimes hold off on molting. I've seen it happen with multiple species. If the cage is overcrowded or they are being menaced by another in a cup sitting too close. If they hold off for too long or try to stop the process once it's begun they are sometimes just unable to molt. They soften up but never shed so they die.

I would guess she was literally preparing to split her back when you decided to mist and that caused her to try to stop the process. I could be wrong. Sometimes they just drop dead. I don't have enough experience with Popas to know exactly how sensitive they are to disturbances. Some species, like Violins, I'm able to move to a new perch just minutes before molt. Others I make sure to give their privacy. Once the molt actually begins there's no stopping so it doesn't matter after that.


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## Krissim Klaw (May 13, 2015)

Aryia said:


> Misting is seriously over-rated. Don't listen when caresheets advise you to mist daily or keep high humidity at all times. It doesn't benefit the mantis in anyway and generally creates more problems. Constant high humidity is just asking for bacterial/mold growth and it creates a horrible environment for a mantis to live in. Imagine living in a damp room where you can't get your feet dry, ever? I mist my nymphs every 3-4 days, adults I mist every week. Sometimes I forget to mist them or miss a couple, nothing bad ever comes of it.


The general rule of thumb when misting is that the water droplets should dry up within a half hour to hour or so. Even when dealing with high humidity species the cage should be drying out between mistings and no mantis should be sitting in water even if you are misting a couple times a day. Generally this is as much of a airation problem as it is misting too much.



Precarious said:


> For the record, I mist every species I keep in the morning and again at night. Even supposed dry species. And I mist extra when a molt is coming. I hate to disagree with members I respect as proven breeders but I seriously doubt misting caused any issues in this instance.


I also tend to mist morning and night, although I tend to feel making sure a mantis has the water they need to drink does more to keep them properly hydrated for sheddings than the humidity itself.



PrayingMantisPets said:


> None of them on my list had molting issues, they all died from various reasons, (molting, murdered by cat, blackdeath, etc.


When you are attempting to breed a species typically how many females and males do you attempt to raise up at the same time?


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## Jay (May 14, 2015)

PrayingMantisPets said:


> Last night i saw that my presub female African Twig Mantis was about to molt. So I sprayed her container and let her be. I got home and shes dead! She was hanging by one leg in the roof of her container. She did not molt but she is really really soft. I honestly do not know what happened. Once again I cannot breed my mantises! I keep trying and trying but i just cant mate them. Anyone know why she died?
> 
> What i failed to breed:
> 
> ...


Perhaps you should focus on parthenocarpic varieties for a while. No mating required! (=


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## LAME (May 14, 2015)

If anything... If you're looking to get into breeding, just choose one species and work with that particular. Taking on so many at once can become a challenge.


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## hibiscusmile (May 14, 2015)

A lot of advice is good here, I say if a mantis drinks when u mist, most times, then it is ok to mist daily, but if they ignore, then they probably are just fine without it.

ps, the disturbance post is exceptionally good, that is just what may of happened.


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## [email protected] (May 15, 2015)

Last year when didn't know better, one of my sub adults was not eating for a while, I did not know why. (a dry species). So, I wanted to make sure she was at least hydrated and I put a drop of water on her front raptor. Of course when she molted that night, her raptor was stuck and caused her to be extremely disfigured. A little off topic, but I've learned to just leave them alone before a molt (unless they are in a bad position). This year I've only had 1 mismolt so far!


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## [email protected] (May 15, 2015)

Oh yeah, as far as mating, I have iris oratorias (don't require a mating) and even though I thought some of them mated, I only have females so far! They are just as healthy!


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## PrayingMantisPets (May 15, 2015)

Great like it will never end. I just checked all 6 of my Polyspilota griffini nymphs. All males! AGAIN! Uggggg :helpsmilie: .


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## LAME (May 16, 2015)

PrayingMantisPets said:


> Great like it will never end. I just checked all 6 of my Polyspilota griffini nymphs. All males! AGAIN! Uggggg :helpsmilie: .


Hey... Hold onto one if you decide to get rid of them. I may need a back up male.


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