# My first attempt at breeding -Acromantis japonica



## CosbyArt (Sep 8, 2015)

I began to worry that one of my Japanese boxer (Acromantis japonica) adults had a problem as it was not eating much compared to the other, and hasn't laid a infertile ooth too. Well closer inspection and I discovered it was a male... Makes me feel old as I would have sworn they were both females when I looked before.

I dug out my jewelers loop to verify as the female is about only 1", and sure enough it was a male. As the female has laid one infertile ooth and is looking gravid again I but together a quick makeshift tank for them to breed in so her ooths can be fertile. They were both feed earlier, and the female didn't want anything to eat so hopefully she is stuffed.

The male, within a moment of being put in the tank jumped on her, and she quickly jumped out knocked the male off and got to the top of the lid before I closed it after adding the male. 




I got her back inside and after a bit of walking he jumped on her again facing the wrong way, but he quickly fixed that.

So far they have been connected for about 40 minutes. Here is a decent photo of them now, and you can see his abdomen is connected. I have others showing more, but no need to put up a photo of the indecency.  

Edit update - The male disconnected after 2 hours and 47 minutes, although he was refusing to let go. I helped him run off quickly by separating them using a small bamboo skewer, which they used as a perch to go back home. They are both back in their habitats, and he survived the ordeal.


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## dmina (Sep 9, 2015)

Great job! congratulations... I am so happy that you did re-check and found he was a male.. I would remate them after her next ooth.... her mama laid 18 ooths.. the last one never hatched... As of right now 2 of her sisters have been bred.. and are laying ooths.... I have one more set still waiting for wings..

Congrats again...


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## CosbyArt (Sep 9, 2015)

dmina said:


> Great job! congratulations... I am so happy that you did re-check and found he was a male.. I would remate them after her next ooth.... her mama laid 18 ooths.. the last one never hatched... As of right now 2 of her sisters have been bred.. and are laying ooths.... I have one more set still waiting for wings..
> 
> Congrats again...


Thanks



I'm really happy about it all, about drove my wife nuts last night with it all. Anymore she is almost to the point she doesn't want to hear anything about my "bugs", let alone my excitement last night lol.

Amazing, 18 ooths. Glad I found about him after just one infertile ooth then.  I will remate her, thanks for the suggestion. Nice to hear yours are doing great as well. It is a great little species and I was a bit brokenhearted when I thought they would both lay just infertile ooths.


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## Deacon (Sep 11, 2015)

This summer, I have raised my first mantids (Chinese) and I just put them together tonight. He is 8 wks old and she is 5 wks so I thought they might be too old but my grandson has been begging me to try breeding them (she hatched in his classroom last May (the only survivor), and I purchased him as a 5th instar on-line.) Since getting their wings, they have been ogling each other most of August from their side-by-side cages. So, I took a large Xmas cactus into my powder room and set in on the toilet seat. I knew I wouldn't lose him if he flew in that small space. They have both been handled and hand fed a lot so I put him on the plant and then her on the other side. I was on my knees taking their picture when he realized she was there and I laughed out loud when he swiveled his head toward her. I was worried for three reasons: she has fluffy wings and looks like a turkey, he is missing half a middle leg, and worst of all, I worried he would lose his head to her and I really like him! Anyway, he jumped her so fast, fluffy wings and all, and a few minutes later they were clearly mated (I have pictures.) After half an hour, my knees were killing me (I've read they shouldn't be disturbed, so there I was with my face 18" away, trying not to move.) At 45 minutes, she walked over to me and climbed up my shirt with him attached! I mean really! I finally got them back onto the plant and a few minutes later, he disengaged and flew to the other side of the plant where I scooped him up and put him safely in his cage. I'm hoping it was a success (she has a drop of extra spermatophore hanging on her--unless she is expelling it on purpose--would she do that?) That was so nerve-wracking! Now I have to read the next chapter of Orin McM"s book to see what to do if she lays an ooth. I just had to share with someone who would understand, as my husband can't stop laughing...N


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## CosbyArt (Sep 11, 2015)

Deacon said:


> This summer, I have raised my first mantids (Chinese) and I just put them together tonight. He is 8 wks old and she is 5 wks so I thought they might be too old but my grandson has been begging me to try breeding them (she hatched in his classroom last May (the only survivor), and I purchased him as a 5th instar on-line.) Since getting their wings, they have been ogling each other most of August from their side-by-side cages. So, I took a large Xmas cactus into my powder room and set in on the toilet seat. I knew I wouldn't lose him if he flew in that small space. They have both been handled and hand fed a lot so I put him on the plant and then her on the other side. I was on my knees taking their picture when he realized she was there and I laughed out loud when he swiveled his head toward her. I was worried for three reasons: she has fluffy wings and looks like a turkey, he is missing half a middle leg, and worst of all, I worried he would lose his head to her and I really like him! Anyway, he jumped her so fast, fluffy wings and all, and a few minutes later they were clearly mated (I have pictures.) After half an hour, my knees were killing me (I've read they shouldn't be disturbed, so there I was with my face 18" away, trying not to move.) At 45 minutes, she walked over to me and climbed up my shirt with him attached! I mean really! I finally got them back onto the plant and a few minutes later, he disengaged and flew to the other side of the plant where I scooped him up and put him safely in his cage. I'm hoping it was a success (she has a drop of extra spermatophore hanging on her--unless she is expelling it on purpose--would she do that?) That was so nerve-wracking! Now I have to read the next chapter of Orin McM"s book to see what to do if she lays an ooth. I just had to share with someone who would understand, as my husband can't stop laughing...N


Nice, congratulations! Also welcome to the forum.  You might post to say hello in the Introduce Yourself section so others can say hello too.  

No need to have to sit on your knees so as not to spook them, as you found out. If the female especially is tamed they have no issue with a human presence once they are connected. Member LAME had a similar experience, and has posted pictures of his female mating on his arm here.

Ha, it is amazing how fast the male can move! My little guy in the photo is less than 1" long and he moved faster than I thought possible.





Although your female might be able to expel the spermatophore, I've never heard of it happening. A usual breeder tip is to mate your female again to ensure she her later ooths are fertile. You can try again in a few days, or wait till a few days after her first ooth is laid (provided that the male is still young enough (2months or less as an adult after the first ooth)).

Great to hear you picked up one of Orin's books, which one did you get? It is undoubtedly full of great information.

I understand, my wife is similar and doesn't care to hear about, "my bugs all the time" - honestly I try not to say anything more than a couple of times a day at most anymore. She got offended by the mating and called it "bug porn".


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## Deacon (Sep 11, 2015)

Thanks for the encouragement. I've tried to do the Introduce Myself section but stupidly can't figure out how. I write my intro and can't see where to hit "enter."

My Orin McMonigle book is Keeping The Praying Mantis--the hardback, pricey one (although it cost less at Amazon.) It lives on my coffee table when my nose is not in it.

If you don't mind, I have a question: Everyone talks about feeding roaches to their mantids. I buy BBfly pupae which the fem. will eat (the flies) but the male hardly eats at all which is why I hand-feed him banana and baby meat, honey and sometimes milk. I've read the males eat less, but he's got to eat something! He does like a moth sometimes but they are hard to find. Neither of them likes crickets and wax worms just hide. So, I was wondering about the roaches. Do yours eat them?


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## CosbyArt (Sep 11, 2015)

Deacon said:


> Thanks for the encouragement. I've tried to do the Introduce Myself section but stupidly can't figure out how. I write my intro and can't see where to hit "enter."
> 
> My Orin McMonigle book is Keeping The Praying Mantis--the hardback, pricey one (although it cost less at Amazon.) It lives on my coffee table when my nose is not in it.
> 
> If you don't mind, I have a question: Everyone talks about feeding roaches to their mantids. I buy BBfly pupae which the fem. will eat (the flies) but the male hardly eats at all which is why I hand-feed him banana and baby meat, honey and sometimes milk. I've read the males eat less, but he's got to eat something! He does like a moth sometimes but they are hard to find. Neither of them likes crickets and wax worms just hide. So, I was wondering about the roaches. Do yours eat them?


Here is a direct link to start a new introduction post. Type a topic, usually people type hello from their state's name, type a bit about yourself in the next box, then underneath all that click the *Post New Topic* button.

Ah, the Keeping the Praying Mantis: Mantodean Captive Biology, Reproduction, and Husbandry book, a excellent choice. I heard several people talk about it but with money being tight I have not ordered it yet. I figure maybe I'll get it as a birthday or Christmas present to myself and sign my wife's name to the package, that way she won't have to get me anything else.  

Depends on the male really, I've had some that go nearly a week before eating, while others do every 2-3 days typically. I try to feed my a small amount everyday, and when they eat I add more feeders for them.

My mantids usually eat GB/BB flies that I get from my fly traps, wax moths (I culture waxworms), and crickets (although not a fan of crickets - cockroaches for me is not a option as my wife says all my "bugs" will be sitting outside if I get any roaches, and she means it). I have been working on getting Milkweed bugs (Oncopeltus fasciatus) setup as feeders too, although they have to go a few generation cycles on sunflower seeds to get rid of their toxicity - but so far so good. I've also tried mealworms, easy to culture, but my mantids refused to eat them. Also a few other cultures I'm sure I am forgetting at this point.  

Besides the GB/BB flies I get from my traps, I also collect other insects for my mantids to eat from the wild. Those have included butterflies (but I avoid now as most are toxic), various moths, field crickets, grasshoppers, and such. Heck even lady bugs, stink bugs, and caterpillars work too (depending on the mantid). I however avoid bees and spiders as I do not want my mantids injured, but I have watched a mantid on the porch catch and eat a wasp.  With winter coming though I am concentrating on my cultures to get them ready, and started the new one of the Milkweed bugs to try this winter.

Cockroaches though many people swear by how great of a feeder they are (easy to breed/culture, don't injure molting mantids, etc.). Seems some use Dubia roaches lately, but due to their large size and hard exoskeletons many use other options. Such as Cuban/ Green Banana Roaches (Panchlora nivea), Little Kenyans (Blaberidae sp. ), and Pallida roach (Phoetalia pallida) to name a few as feeders.

There are some that are pest roaches that are used as feeders too. Such as Turkish roach (Shelfordella lateralis), Oriental cockroach (Blatta orientalis) believe it or not, and heard once of the common German cockroach (Blattella germanica) too. I think more than anything the pest roaches are used as the keepers find a source to easy get a culture going, and if they are infested anyway they are not worried of escapees.

While depending on your weather, location, and house (leaky water/moisture/cleanliness/etc - all species have a possibility of becoming a pest. Infestation from escapees (they happen some in any feeder insect) are not just possible like the others, the last three are guaranteed you will be infested with them. So be careful when choosing a species to use as a feeder.


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## Deacon (Sep 11, 2015)

Thank you again. I just "introduced myself." However, I can't get a picture to upload  

I will skip the roaches, thank you. I am going to google all the names you gave me though in case I recognize one. Maybe the black beetles I see under the potted plants outside would be okay. I just don't want to poison the mantids out of ignorance.

I do have a culture of waxworms but I feed so many to the Chickadees that I now order 2000 a week. I just threw 200 into my bin so they can pupate for my mantis. There were four moths sitting there so I fed the male. Moments later, he had his first live-catch in weeks! How do they ever survive in the wild if they are so picky about their meals?

So, do you have a trick for catching moths outside? My porch lights don't attract them.

Neither mantid will eat waxworms or mealworms. He won't eat crickets and she will eat their heads only so I don't buy them anymore. He doesn't seem to eat the BB flies, she does. He eats waxworm moths, she doesn't. So, I hand feed them baby meat and bananas, sometimes honey and milk, several times a week and I worry they are not getting enough.


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## CosbyArt (Sep 11, 2015)

Deacon said:


> Thank you again. I just "introduced myself." However, I can't get a picture to upload
> 
> I will skip the roaches, thank you. I am going to google all the names you gave me though in case I recognize one. Maybe the black beetles I see under the potted plants outside would be okay. I just don't want to poison the mantids out of ignorance.
> 
> ...


Your welcome. In regards to photos it is a common problem, and the forum limits how many you can have anyway. So the majority of us have a free account at Photobucket and simply paste the link into the image icon when posting (message toolbar) to have it displayed. In my guide here in steps 4 and 5, it shows how to get the Photobucket link.

Don't blame you about roaches, accidents happen and you wouldn't want a infestation. I got about 5000 mealworms that escaped in my room, luckily I got the majority before they got away. The rest took about 2 1/2 hours of moving everything to clean/find them all.

Glad to hear your male at least likes them. In the wild I assume there is just such a diverse insect population they can choose what they want. Or more likely get hungry enough to eat anything. It sounds like you have some really picky mantids, can't say I've heard of any that bad before. Good idea on the wax moths, but depending on their instar/life cycle and the room temp it can take a month or more for moths to be ready. Of course if you have so many waxworms sounds like you won't have a problem staging fresh waxworms to keep some moths always handy.

For moths you setup a sheet in the backyard, like over a clothesline, and place a lamp at the bottom. Wait till dark and turn it on and wait for them to come. For a good guide, with photos check out this topic. Also you can make some moth bait as described here. For me though in the city I find it easier to hold a flashlight in one hand and a aerial net in my other. Using the stick end of the net I sweep/disturb the weeds/flowers/grass and with the flashlight pointed there any moths will come to the flashlight. I then just catch them with the net, but a tip though - hold the flashlight away from you a bit so you have room to swing and get them in the net (it also keeps the moths from flying into your head). It hasn't happened yet, but I am still waiting for someone to call the cops on me as a "prowler" and have to explain to the cops I am catching moths for my mantids lol.


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## MantidBro (Sep 11, 2015)

congrats on mating them!


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## CosbyArt (Sep 11, 2015)

MantidBro said:


> congrats on mating them!


Thanks. I can't wait to see how tiny her nymphs are. If I remember right, those are the ones Dmina called Nymph-ants


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## MantidBro (Sep 11, 2015)

CosbyArt said:


> Thanks. I can't wait to see how tiny her nymphs are. If I remember right, those are the ones Dmina called Nymph-ants


Lol i can imagine!


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## Deacon (Sep 12, 2015)

Thanks for the links to catching moths---now I know how to recycle my husband's golf practice net--it'll make a great stand for a sheet!

You have been a great help in many areas. Thank you very much!

Nancy


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## CosbyArt (Sep 12, 2015)

Deacon said:


> Thanks for the links to catching moths---now I know how to recycle my husband's golf practice net--it'll make a great stand for a sheet!
> 
> You have been a great help in many areas. Thank you very much!
> 
> Nancy


That does sound like a great stand for a sheet, and no construction or rigging needed.  

Your quite welcome, I'm more than happy to help.


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## CosbyArt (Sep 24, 2015)

Update -

The little momma boxer I named Ogino (after Sadayuki Ogino the "mother" of Japanese boxing (but was a guy actually)) laid her fertile ooth tonight! This is her 2nd and was 22 days since her first, and 16 days since she mated. The thing is a whopper compared to her first and infertile ooth, the new fertile one is about 3 times longer. I'll have to add a photo of both ooths for comparison when I can safely removed it once it has dried/hardened in a day or so. I'm proud of her, and she enjoyed a cricket afterwards.





The father I named Watanabe, same story there - Yūjirō Watanabe is the father of Japanese boxing.


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## CosbyArt (Sep 27, 2015)

Here are Ogino's ooths. On the left is her first, and infertile ooth. The other is the ooth she laid 15 days after mating. The new ooth measures in about 0.88", while the first one is 0.43" (both not counting the trailing off areas with no eggs). Not triple in size but double for sure  

She is already working on a new ooth too. I tried mating them again a few hours ago for about 40 minutes, and I re-positioned the male many times, but neither were interested so I put them back in their homes for the night. I'll keep trying till they do again though.


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## Brunneria (Sep 27, 2015)

Congratulation! Sounds like your female is very productive  

I've been wanting to see this species in real life, and even visited their habitat in South Korea (Jeju island), but could never find them


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## CosbyArt (Sep 27, 2015)

Brunneria said:


> Congratulation! Sounds like your female is very productive
> 
> I've been wanting to see this species in real life, and even visited their habitat in South Korea (Jeju island), but could never find them


Thanks. According to Dmina her mantid, mine's parent mantid, laid 18 ooths. So my girl has a few yet to go.  

Sorry to hear that, hope you still had a good trip to Jeju island (looks like a beautiful place, and amazing water). Although it isn't their natural habitat, you can try the species yourself. I will offering nymphs and maybe some ooths for sale/trade coming up.


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## Brunneria (Sep 28, 2015)

CosbyArt said:


> Thanks. According to Dmina her mantid, mine's parent mantid, laid 18 ooths. So my girl has a few yet to go.
> 
> Sorry to hear that, hope you still had a good trip to Jeju island (looks like a beautiful place, and amazing water). Although it isn't their natural habitat, you can try the species yourself. I will offering nymphs and maybe some ooths for sale/trade coming up.


Yes, trip was awesome! Even though I didn't see the mantids I still got a chance to see other rare insects  

18 oothe...that's a lot! I now know who to trade my Brunner's oothe with when I get surplus......LOL


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