# Tawainese Mantids _ a test_Odontomantis planiceps



## Fisherman_Brazil

Friend of mine, the gentleman "Flying Mantis" offer me to post his recent photos, which is always inspiring, and I encurage him to publish on the forum. so here we are!


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## OGIGA

Awesome! I hope to see more!


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## Fisherman_Brazil

Adult male


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## wuwu

wow, crazy looking mantid and nice pics!


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## Jenn

Very nice work!!!


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## OGIGA

Breath-taking pictures indeed!


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## yen_saw

Very nice pics Luke, your friend took beautiful pics. I remember getting this species once from Taiwan. The hatchling looks exactly like an ant!


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## wuwu

hey luke, do you know what camera and lens your friend used for these beautiful photos?


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## Fisherman_Brazil

Hi, Wuwu,

Here is the website

http://blepharopsis.deviantart.com/gallery/

that has information second to none.

Enjoy

Luke


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## yen_saw

Cute little fellow!! smallest adult male i have ever seen, adult male is only about 1.5 cm!! but they are so aggressive that i saw one attacking it's own poop :lol: Adult female has beautiful jade green wings. They do resemble queen ants (before mating). I hope to pair them up soon, but I'm really worry if the head of adult male remain intact afterwards.

Adult male






(Hi.... pardon my huge eyes, i have a thick glass on!!  )

Adult female


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## robo mantis

Those eyes are weird :shock:


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## Ian

Those photos are just out of this world, what camera are you using?

Really crisp, sharp shots.

Lovely mantis to


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## Asa

> Those eyes are weird :shock:


Yeah, they almost pop out.


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## hibiscusmile

Oh! so beautiful!


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## OGIGA

Beautiful!!! I love those eyes. Looks cartoonish actually. I wish they are bigger though because I really like large mantises.


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## Way.Of.The.Mantis

Wow very nice! :shock:


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## AFK

absolutely amazing pics!


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## yen_saw

Mating only lasted 30 minutes or so.











Male survived!!


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## jmac27

Fisherman, your friend is an excellent photographer and that is a beautiful mantid. Any idea what camera/lenses he was using?


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## Fisherman_Brazil

Canon 350D + Sigma APO 150mm F2.8 EX DG HSM MACRO is the equipment he is using.

Fisherman is an ideal job that I wanna to be, simmilar to that I want my son to be a medical doctor, and he might end up with a truck driver anyway. Myself teach in an engineering school.

Seemingly, many of you gentlemen like my friend's photo shot, wish he can communicate with you in person.

Visit his Blog for more of his new works if you please.

http://tw.myblog.yahoo.com/orchid-mantis

Thank you all for visiting

Any further question, please Call, email, or PM me whichever you are care to.


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## drizzt

Great, great photos. More pleasee  )


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## bubforever

Amazing pics, that is one cool mantis. I want one now.


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## yen_saw

More mating and I have collected 4 othecae so far! I was told this species is a breeding machine!












One of the male couldn't make it  he is so small!






Now can't wait to see the ant mimic hatchling.


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## jmac27

Wow, he was tiny.


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## Asa

I'm considering getting one. Especially for that 'breeding machine' :lol:


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## OGIGA

Yen, when you say collected, do you mean you went out to get some? Or did you mean the mantises laid it?


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## yen_saw

not collected in the wild Ogiga, it was from the container, here are few more oothecae glued to the container.






and the female just don't stop eating!!! very aggressive... stocking up for her next ooth


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## yen_saw

One of the oothecae hatched out only after 24 days!!

Looks more like little black ant than a mantis, about 30 nymphs hatched out.


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## OGIGA

Wow, that's really quick. Certainly looks a lot more like an ant. How big are these nymphs?


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## yen_saw

they are only 5 mm, i wouldn't know this is a mantis if i find one in the wild. The abdomen is not curled up like most mantis hatchling, which is making them look almost the same as ant. They even developed a sharp-looking sting at the end of the abdomen when i zoomed into the pic, great ant mimicry!


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## Asa

Man! Those are so cool!


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## yen_saw

Well, this one grow super fast too, appear to be just another molt away from adult, and it was just a month ago when they hatched.


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## Asa

Wow, that is quick!


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## OGIGA

Wow, insane-looking!


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## buddhistsoldier88

That ant form is truly impressive! When some say the orchid looks like an ant when really young i can see it. Lil difficult because the head isso oddly shaped, but with this species! :shock: Thought yen was mistaken for a sec til i saw the claws!


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## Red

really pretty mantis.....

a question.... which glue do you used to glue the ootheques?

regards


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## Fisherman_Brazil

Hot glue is common use, however, recently I use the silicon glue, which is used for bathroom tub will do well without doing any harm to the ooth.

Luke


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## OGIGA

I've used Elmer's glue. If my ooth hatches, I'll continue to use it.


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## Fisherman_Brazil

This creature, not only the eggs laying machine, the male also a se_xmaniacs. The male can handle several females without much of the rest, and while with female, he will do whatever he can and skillfully running around to avoid getting eaten. Very impressing indeed!


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## yen_saw

> really pretty mantis.....a question.... which glue do you used to glue the ootheques?
> 
> regards


I use hot glue as well.


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## Fisherman_Brazil

Master pieces! speaks for itself from my friend Flying mantis.

Luke from Taiwan

Asa, this is respose to your request. Please enjoy!


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## Ben.M

That's an amazing pic, such vibrant green  8)


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## Asa

> Master pieces! speaks for itself from my friend Flying mantis.
> 
> Luke from Taiwan
> 
> Asa, this is respose to your request. Please enjoy!


Thanks!! Surprised you remembered actually.


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## yen_saw

Nice one!! It was difficult for me to capture the pic of even one mating pair due to this species' "panicking" behaviour, to have two pairs on the same pic is amazing!


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## Fisherman_Brazil

Flying mantis is showing up himself, therefore, I shall give him back the full credit of these beautiful photos.

Thank you all my friends, and particurly, Yen and Flying mantis who make this species spred to the world among hobyists.

Luke from Taiwan


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## Kruszakus

I've been thinking - how do you keep this mantid? I have been keeping six hatchlings at 26-28 degrees celcius for 14-15 hours a day, and then the rest of the day at 23-24 degrees, and spraying their containers a bit every two days.

I'm not sure if I do the right thing. Could someone please help me, and give me some advice on these mantids?


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## yen_saw

Fisherman_Brazil said:


> Flying mantis is showing up himself, therefore, I shall give him back the full credit of these beautiful photos.Thank you all my friends, and particurly, Yen and Flying mantis who make this species spred to the world among hobyists.
> 
> Luke from Taiwan


Luke, thanks for giving me the chance to explore into this wonderful species. Flying mantis is the "new kid on the block" in this hobby  

Kruszakus, i have great success with this species keeping them warm 80-85F and mist them on daily basis, sometimes mist heavily in the morning, and again at night.


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## Fisherman_Brazil

Kruszakus said:


> I've been thinking - how do you keep this mantid? I have been keeping six hatchlings at 26-28 degrees celcius for 14-15 hours a day, and then the rest of the day at 23-24 degrees, and spraying their containers a bit every two days.I'm not sure if I do the right thing. Could someone please help me, and give me some advice on these mantids?


Although not critical, they really love higher temperture at about 32C. Water spraying is not that critical as well, but they will drink from your daily mist. 14-15 hours may be too long( I would make it 12), but not actually affect their breeding as well. Please note that this species is from southern part of Taiwan, where the weather is sub-tropical, so you might need to justify the conditions to where you live.

Luke


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## Kruszakus

Hehehe - I was advised to keep them at 24-26 degrees (please, don't use any other measurements, I'm from Poland, we use only celcius degrees) - but I've been keeping them at 30 degrees from time to time, and it produced some good results - I'll keep it that way from now on.

By the way - have you got this problem that I have? They don't seem to be so eager when it comes to feeding time, they often get scared even by the smallest fruit flies...


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## spawn

From Celcius (X) to Fahrenheit (Y): Y = (X x 9/5) + 32

From Fahrenheit (X) to Celcius (Y): Y = (X -32) 5/9

Take the extra minute to do the conversion when posting on a site with multinational members, or just do the math yourself.


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## Kruszakus

What if someone has math dyslexia? I just made a polite request, it's easier with measurements that are used in most of the countries.

But let's not stray from the topic of this thread.


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## asdsdf

yen_saw said:


> Well, this one grow super fast too, appear to be just another molt away from adult, and it was just a month ago when they hatched.


It's a male right? I'm trying to sex mine, and it looks like one has 7 segments, and another 8. :huh: I was using a magnifying glass too. Plus, is it normal for male and female to be subadult at the same time?


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## Kruszakus

Oh, by the way - how many times do these mantids molt?

One month since when it was a hatchling, and it's so big already? Somehow it feels unreal - mine moulted for the first time after 9-12 from the day I bought them.


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## ThorEH

spawn said:


> From Celcius (X) to Fahrenheit (Y): Y = (X x 9/5) + 32From Fahrenheit (X) to Celcius (Y): Y = (X -32) 5/9
> 
> Take the extra minute to do the conversion when posting on a site with multinational members, or just do the math yourself.


Well, as you americans are the only ones using F, perhaps you should do the math, when posting on a site with multinational members ?


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## Ben.M

http://www.metric-conversions.org/temperature-conversion.htm


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## hibiscusmile

yen_saw said:


> Nice one!! It was difficult for me to capture the pic of even one mating pair due to this species' "panicking" behaviour, to have two pairs on the same pic is amazing!


I had 4, check out my post "LOOK, Ant that an Orgy" :lol:


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## asdsdf

ThorEH said:


> Well, as you americans are the only ones using F, perhaps you should do the math, when posting on a site with multinational members ?


 &lt;_&lt; 

*But let's not stray from the topic of this thread.*

Yes, how many molts does an ant mantis have? It's been less than a month, and mine are subadult.


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## Kruszakus

I can't believe it! Mine moulted for the first time this week (between Monday and Mednesday), and this is the third week of their lives...

But now they are rejecting food and their abdomens are a bit swollen - hmmm, if a big mantid like Tenodera can moult from 4th instar to 5th in just seven days, then I guess that if they will moult anytime soon, I should not be surprised.


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## asdsdf

Kruszakus said:


> I can't believe it! Mine moulted for the first time this week (between Monday and Mednesday), and this is the third week of their lives...But now they are rejecting food and their abdomens are a bit swollen - hmmm, if a big mantid like Tenodera can moult from 4th instar to 5th in just seven days, then I guess that if they will moult anytime soon, I should not be surprised.


Mednesday, lol. But anyways, they won't eat until at least around a day after they molt. Don't worry about it too much.


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## Kruszakus

I know the correct spelling, hehehe - I don't know where that came from. Probably an imp rotated the "W" and made it "M"!

Anyway - someone will tell me how many molts these mantids go through?


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## asdsdf

Kruszakus said:


> I know the correct spelling, hehehe - I don't know where that came from.


Lol. I knew you did....  

Do you have ant mantids? Is it normal for ants to be subadult at the same time as a female, or does a female molt twice after first getting little budwings?


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## yen_saw

asdsdf said:


> It's a male right? I'm trying to sex mine, and it looks like one has 7 segments, and another 8. :huh: I was using a magnifying glass too. Plus, is it normal for male and female to be subadult at the same time?


Yes it is a subadult male.



ThorEH said:


> Well, as you americans are the only ones using F, perhaps you should do the math, when posting on a site with multinational members ?


80F-85F = ~27C - 29C. There, happy Mom?  



asdsdf said:


> Yes, how many molts does an ant mantis have? It's been less than a month, and mine are subadult.


Male needs only 6 and female 7 (I could be wrong  ), as usual, it takes longer for a subadult to mature as more time is needed to develop wing and a mature sexual organ. Again, the period between subadult and adult is very much depend on temperature and food supply.


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## asdsdf

yen_saw said:


> Yes it is a subadult male.80F-85F = ~27C - 29C. There, happy Mom?
> 
> Male needs only 6 and female 7 (I could be wrong  ), as usual, it takes longer for a subadult to mature as more time is needed to develop wing and a mature sexual organ. Again, the period between subadult and adult is very much depend on temperature and food supply.


Thanks. Wow, the female in question molted again. (3 days after he last molt???I was wondeing how she grew bigger when it was three days afterwards, until I saw a hanging skin..... :lol: ) She is now a true subadult, with more noticable wings.


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## asdsdf

Oops, I double posted, and I can't delete this, so, yay, i have two males and a female!!!!


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## yen_saw

Yes female is considerably larger than male, a subadult female is bulkier and longer than the adult male for this species.


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## Kruszakus

Yes, this is all nice, but we can see the difference in the pictures posted here.

I would really like to know if I have to delay the male's moults, or If it don't matter at all.


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## yen_saw

No need to purposely slow down the male, as subadult female for this species doesn't take a long time to moult into adult, unlike other species like orchid mantis where subadult female can take a month or more to moult into adult.


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## Kruszakus

Yeah, but H. Coronatus has a big difference between the number of moults between male and a female - plus, the male lives for only a couple of weeks...

I would still like to know after which moult they will be adult - it will make some things easier for me...

BTW - my Odomantids are getting ready for their second moult - I cannot wait until that happens.


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## yen_saw

Kruszakus said:


> Yeah, but H. Coronatus has a big difference between the number of moults between male and a female - plus, the male lives for only a couple of weeks...I would still like to know after which moult they will be adult - it will make some things easier for me...
> 
> BTW - my Odomantids are getting ready for their second moult - I cannot wait until that happens.


Adult male orchid mantis lives longer than 2 weeks!! Anyway, i am just using _H. Coronatus _as an example comparing with the time a subadult female takes moulting into adult. You really don't have to worry about the moulting differences between both male and female of this species (_Odontomantis_) they will breed alright.


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## Kruszakus

Right, here is the thing...

As nymphs they were somewhat reluctant when it came to hunt fruit flies - it took two weeks for them to finally moult.

After the first mould they started to be more eager to hunt fruit flies, but only small ones - and they sometimes were scared by aphids, which was strange to me.

Then they moulted and became even more agressive hunters, tackled D. Hydei pretty well...

But now some of them are after their third moult - and they are eating like mad - large fruit flies, Indianmeal moths, small max moths - it took only three days to feed them to a level when their abdomens were loaded...

Tell me, just how much voracious will they become when adult?


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## yen_saw

They remain agressive all the way. Small species but capable of chase down and kill a large prey.


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## Kruszakus

How large? They say one inch - but they said the same about O. Distinctus - today my female moulted into adulthood, and she is only 1.5 cm - you can't call that an inch, now can you?  

I reluctantly agreed to buy those mantids - but Joanna was very persuasive... thank God! Now it's me favorite!


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## yen_saw

1.5 cm sounds like the size of an adult male, all my female grow to slightly above an inch, and adult male come up to about 0.75 inch. Do you have a pic of your specimen next to a ruler?

Yeah i am sure Empiu (Joanna) likes this species too.


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## Kruszakus

I do not have a camera good enough to make a picture like that  

With 1.5 cm I was referring to O. Distinctus - that is the size of my adult female, nasty little beast - her arms are so massive!

My Odontomantids are almost all after their third moult, so up to 12 milimiters if fed.

Joanna never had a chance to experience how cool this species is, as I mentioned in one of my PM, all of her Taiwaneese died, most likely due to a food poisoning - mine are doing well, Im expecting one that moulted five days ago to molt quite soon!


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