# Ootheca pic



## galapoheros (Mar 22, 2008)

Is this likely a Stagmomantis carolina ootheca (Texas)?


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## Morpheus uk (Mar 23, 2008)

Looks like it to me ive never kept them though


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## Rick (Mar 23, 2008)

Looks like a european mantis ooth.


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## mantis shadow (Mar 27, 2008)

i would have to agree with rick and say european manits also.


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## Andrew (Mar 27, 2008)

Actually, it is a _Stagmomantis_ of some sort. _M. religiosa_ is more foamy.

http://bugguide.net/node/view/154902/bgimage


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## macro junkie (Mar 27, 2008)

looks just like my jade mantis ooth,Hierodula solomonis - jade mantis..im not saying thats what it is..it just looks like the one i have thats all.


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## galapoheros (Mar 29, 2008)

I found it in the w tx desert while hiking around Lajitas, brought it back. I kept about 10 babies, I'll post pics of some later. They are still real small. But looks like they are going to be diff colors.

Here's how they are looking now.


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## Hypoponera (Mar 29, 2008)

Looks like Stegmomantis limbata ooth. The nymphs are definatly Stegmomantis sp. Colors can range from brigh green to tan/cream to brown. Color variation is normal. Some may even keep the stripes on the legs.


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## OGIGA (Apr 4, 2008)

I say stagmomantis, but I don't know which species. I can't even tell the difference between the stagmomantises even when they're adults.


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## galapoheros (Apr 5, 2008)

Ok thanks. I'll post some pics at they grow B) . I hope...


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## hibiscusmile (Apr 5, 2008)

Positively not Religiosa!


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## joossa (Apr 5, 2008)

bytorsnowdog said:


> Ok thanks. I'll post some pics at they grow B) . I hope...


Good luck with them. _Stagmomantis sp_. are underrated, IMO. =)


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## galapoheros (Apr 14, 2008)

Just an update post showing some growth. Also, I found an ooth in my backyard. It's the smaller one in the pic. Can anybody ID it? The top one that is much bigger is where these babies came from. The reason I grabbed it was because it was on the large side. Does the smaller ooth look like it's from a Stagmomantis specie too? I saw one that looked like the smaller one on the web and was labeled as a Stag ooth but I certainly don't believe everything I see or read. Most Stags I've seen on roads aren't that big but I have seen two really big ones, I kept both of them. I had a huge, stocky bright green one back in 1985 that I caught crossing the road at night, it was impressive.


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## Andrew (Apr 14, 2008)

The smaller ooth is _Iris oratoria_.


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## joossa (Apr 15, 2008)

Those bulging eyes! Signature of the _Stagmomantis_!

Hmm... about that small ooth... I agree with Andrew that it looks like I. oratoria... but in Texas!? I didn't know their range extended that far east. Maybe someone has been releasing them there?


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## MantidLord (Apr 16, 2008)

joossa said:


> Those bulging eyes! Signature of the _Stagmomantis_!Hmm... about that small ooth... I agree with Andrew that it looks like I. oratoria... but in Texas!? I didn't know their range extended that far east. Maybe someone has been releasing them there?


Yeah, its an I. oratoria (i feel proud). But i didn't know their range extended that far either. But don't they like desert conditions anyway joosa? Good luck with them. Still waiting for mine to hatch in a couple of months (late May or June).

P.S. if you plan on raising them, you might want to ask joosa for help.  I've only kept adults, and as I said, my first ooths haven't hatched yet.


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## Hypoponera (Apr 16, 2008)

Well now! If I oritoria is found in Texas, I better get down to southern New Mexico and start looking. I know the species is found in southern Arizona. I would expect the species range to continue to slowly move East along the border areas where temps get good and hot. I had not expected the species to have moved so far so fast. Then again, maybe it just hitched a ride and skipped right past me!


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## galapoheros (Apr 17, 2008)

OK, so the smaller one is I. oratoria, thanks ..glad it's interesting to some that I found it in my backyard here in TX. I live about 10 miles north of Austin. Well this ooth is empty, and I think some of those wasps I've read about had gotten to it a little too. There were a couple of long thin wasps that looked like mini Rove beetles with long wings moving around on the ooth, they looked like they were maybe a little longer than 1/4 inch. I don't know what the ooth attacking wasps look like. I'm out of town so I hope I left the young Stags with enough food.


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## MantidLord (Apr 17, 2008)

Do you have anyone keeping the nymphs? You have to mist them too, so they can molt fine. I hope your not gone too long. It possibly was a parasitic wasp, or it could have been infertile.

where do you think I. oratoria will stop "advancing"? I thought Texas would be the final state. Good Luck.


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## Hypoponera (Apr 19, 2008)

It is quite possible that the species will eventually cover all of the lower 48 states. It would do well if introduced into Hawaii as well. They like high heat and humidity. That is why they are found through out the Med region. But they can tolorate colder areas as well.


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## MantidLord (Apr 19, 2008)

that's cool. But does anyone know if they're having negative affects on the native species?


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## galapoheros (Apr 20, 2008)

I just got back today and all 12 are OK but they ate all their fruit flies while I was gone, a few molted. I sprayed right away. Almost time to move up to larger prey. I'm looking forward to getting more variety in their diet. I guess I. oratoria (males) was what I was seeing around my porch light at night last summer.


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## galapoheros (Apr 22, 2008)

More recent molts in the past couple of days. Is the species getting easier to ID? Stagmomantiiiis ....?


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## MantidLord (Apr 22, 2008)

Yeah, we're pretty much positive what sp. it is. Your lucky to have all 12 survive, and not a single canible incident (unless you seperated them). Male I. oratorias will fly toward porch lights often, but the females only have budwings, and cannot fly. If you ever catch a mantis in your area, check to see if it has an orange-red spot on its second to last segment (on abdomen). If it does (male or female), its an I. oratoria.  

Good Luck.


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## Hypoponera (Apr 23, 2008)

Some of you may already have this but I figuered it will be helpful to post part again. This is part of a key that identifies all species of mantids found in the US. Send me your email and I will send the whole key to you!

You must be patient as the keys only work reliably with adult mantids.







It is possible that you have one of 3 different Stegmomantis species. S. carolina, S. limbata and S. californica are all to be found in parts of Texas. I do not have very detailed range info from TX at this time though. The key will be helpful when your critters become adults.


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## galapoheros (Apr 23, 2008)

Well most people are leaning towards S. carolina so far but it still has not been nailed down yet by anybody. Yes I separated them a long time ago, two or three days after they hatched. They couldn't even eat together because the movements of each other was distracting them from prey other than themselves, just made sense to separate them. All 12 still alive, I'm surprised all are alive even though they are separated. One was stumbling and hungry yesterday, I thought it was a gonner but it managed to finally grab a ffly and all fattened up now. Cool, thanks Hypoponera, I'm going to take a look at that.


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## MikhailsDinos (Apr 23, 2008)

Mike, sent me this key and I must say I'm fascinated by it to no end. It's very helpful when identifying species in the field.  

I wish I saw this post earlier. I find it very interesting.

Thanks again

Mikhail


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## MantidLord (Apr 23, 2008)

Yeah, Mikes key is very useful


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## galapoheros (May 4, 2008)

Just a few more pics after another molt. All 12 still alive, this is the biggest one right now, moved up to eating crix and other things besides fflies.


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## joossa (May 5, 2008)

Lovely _Stagmomantis_!

Keep us posted!


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## Ben.M (May 5, 2008)

It would be nice to get some more of these in the UK, lovely species


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## ABbuggin (May 5, 2008)

bytorsnowdog said:


> Well most people are leaning towards S. carolina so far but it still has not been nailed down yet by anybody.


They are most definitely not _Stagmomantis, carolina_. I am 120% positive that they are not them. I breed _S. carolina_ every year and they never (although similar) look like yours. I know next to nothing about the other two sp. that they could be, I'll do a little research and I'll post my decision. B)


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## galapoheros (May 5, 2008)

Not S. carolina? ..that would be awesome, I like a mystery. I know they can bubble up the ooth but regardless, going by the size of the ooth, I'm guessing the female was a decent size ...just rolling the dice there. Here are a few more pics.


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## joossa (May 6, 2008)

If not carolina, maybe _Stagmomantis limbata_?


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## galapoheros (May 29, 2008)

Here's how they are looking lately. I'm really looking forward to the next molt.


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## galapoheros (May 31, 2008)

Hello, I've been wondering if there is a way to tell if a mantis is subadult? I'm trying to figure out if this one has one molt left, or two. I'm thinking one is left, just because of it's size. It's hard for me to think there are two left. I lost count of the molts, that would be a way but is there another way to tell?


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## Andrew (May 31, 2008)

Look at the wing buds. The one in the photo a couple posts above is a subadult.

Sometimes it can be tricky. Even experienced keepers mess up sometimes.


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## galapoheros (May 31, 2008)

It's easy to see the buds get bigger with molts, I guess it takes getting familiar with each species and looking at the buds to know if the finale molt is coming up. I don't know if I'll do this again any time soon. I have a lot of other inverts. These mantids have required way more attention than the other inverts I have. And I like to go out of town this time of year. I can't give up now though. I have to stay here and see them to adult stage so I can finally see what species they are and maybe get some ooths.


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## MantidLord (Jun 2, 2008)

About the sub adult question. I actually counted the molts of my nymphs, and now some are L5. Is this subadult or pre-subadult? I can see wing buds, But the L5s don't seem to be only one molt from adult (too small). Sorry I can't post pics, and the sp. is I. oratoria by the way.

P.S. please don't give up raising this mystery sp. I love the pics, and they are really cool.


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## galapoheros (Jun 5, 2008)

Here's a male eating a small cicada. Getting closer to the final molt and we'll finally see what it is! Haha, no big deal, maybe S. limbata? What's that other one where the sp name starts with a "v"? Oh well, just have to wait.


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## MantidLord (Jun 9, 2008)

Nice pic. Judging by the way your's looks, I'd say mine are the same instar (sub-adult). I do know people didn't know if it was limbata, californica, or carolina. I don't know what "V" you're talking about. Good luck.


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## galapoheros (Jun 9, 2008)

Yeah I'm considering all. Somebody ruled out S. carolina, but I haven't in my own mind, just going to have to wait and see. I found that other name, it was Stagmomantis venusta.


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## hibiscusmile (Jun 9, 2008)

Doesn't look like my limbatas, they are green and no strips!


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## hibiscusmile (Jun 9, 2008)

Yea, I am leaning to Carolina, in the morniiinnnngggggggggggg! sorry a little tune escaped me :lol:


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## Hypoponera (Jun 9, 2008)

Never heard of "S. venusta". Where did you find info on it? I don't think any Stegmomantis with a name like that is native.

I still think you've got S. limbata. All of mine have those nice stipes! Love the tiger stripe camo pattern.


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## galapoheros (Jun 9, 2008)

Sweeeet caroline...u, ...bla bla bla bla bla bla blaaaa, me too, anyway, I'm thinking they might be S. carolina that may look a little diff because maybe over 1000's of generations, their coloration has adapted to the environment I found them in :huh: . That's just my guess. Well gotta go to the porch light and get food for them again.


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## galapoheros (Jun 11, 2008)

I can't remember where I first saw S. venusta mentioned, there sure isn't a lot of info on it. These I have are prob not S. venusta just going by how little info is out there about S. venusta. Maybe they aren't real common but according to this site they are native to the US. I don't know anything about the site.

http://www.itis.gov/servlet/SingleRpt/Sing...ch_value=666631


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## galapoheros (Jun 11, 2008)

"I still think you've got S. limbata. All of mine have those nice stipes! Love the tiger stripe camo pattern."

I've seen plenty of pics of S. limbata with stripes too, assuming they got the ID right so who knows?.... sure could be S. limbata, we will find out any day now. A little off topic, when comparing S. limbata and S. carolina, does one species generally get bigger than the other?


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## Hypoponera (Jun 13, 2008)

Thanks for the link! I do not know how accurate the site is though. Quite possible that I would not have heard of that species. But I doubt there would be 3 seperate genera that were unknown to me. I have forwarded it to another member and will wait for him to have a look at it. Maybe I have just been spending too much time under my rock!!


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## MantidLord (Jun 13, 2008)

Hypoponera said:


> Thanks for the link! I do not know how accurate the site is though. Quite possible that I would not have heard of that species. But I doubt there would be 3 seperate genera that were unknown to me. I have forwarded it to another member and will wait for him to have a look at it. Maybe I have just been spending too much time under my rock!!


Maybe a revision to your infamous key is in order? :lol: 

[email protected] my rock.


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## galapoheros (Jun 13, 2008)

Woosh!, had a few drinks last night, had to log on today and see if I said anything crazy. Cool, I'm curious to see what you find out about that species. Maybe that site hasn't been revised, it might be old. I spend too much time looking Under rocks, maybe I've seen you.


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## Hypoponera (Jun 13, 2008)

I was actually thinking some revisions had been done that I didn't know about. Maybe someone has done some taxonomic work for a paper.

I would love to add to that key! But I want some info first. Since I have not heard of the "new" species listed, I don't know what features to write into the key. But I will make any additions necessary should that site's info get verified!

Which rocks have you been looking under? Did you find my bottle of Baileys? I lost it while under a rock and just can't remember which one!


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## hibiscusmile (Jun 14, 2008)

[SIZE=12pt]  Oh Darn! Was that yours? It is poison and I poured it out  [/SIZE][SIZE=12pt]No, that wasn't it, I tripped over that big rock you guys were sleeping under...&amp; it accidently fell out of my poor hands and broke...No, wait a minute, The sun dried it up, yea that was it ... the Sun! :lol: [/SIZE]


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## galapoheros (Jun 14, 2008)

"Oh Darn! Was that yours? It is poison and I poured it out No, that wasn't it, I tripped over that big rock you guys were sleeping under...&amp; it accidently fell out of my poor hands and broke...No, wait a minute, The sun dried it up, yea that was it ... the Sun!"

Dang! you beat me to it. It is poison right?, ..certainly not good for you. It's just for special occasions, like when the sun comes up  haha, just kiddin, I don't see how some people do that. Anyway, one more pic before the final molt. I don't know how to describe that color, kinda neat though.


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## galapoheros (Jun 14, 2008)

Finally, an adult female.


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## MantidLord (Jun 16, 2008)

I think it's a carolina. Not really familiar with any stagmomantis sp. though.

BTW: congratulations on a cool mantis. Will you breed them?


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## Hypoponera (Jun 16, 2008)

Are her hind wings a "lemon-yellow"? If so, its S. limbata.


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## MantidLord (Jun 16, 2008)

Hypoponera said:


> Are her hind wings a "lemon-yellow"? If so, its S. limbata.


Are the wings the only difference?


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## galapoheros (Jun 17, 2008)

I tried to get one to go into a threat pose to see the wings but I haven't seen one do it yet. I can see enough under the wing covers to see that they are yellow though. Yellow and black. So finally we are seeing that they are S. limbata? I've got 3 females and some males. I may as well breed them later.


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## Hypoponera (Jun 18, 2008)

For the females, the wing color is the easiest feature to ID. Limbata females have a lemon-yellow hind wing. The S. californica females have brown hind wings with purplish highlights. The male S. californica has 4 dark bands on the upper surface of the abdomen. The male S. limbata lacks the bands. But the bands are really only easily seen on DEAD specimens. They seem to be the only ones that will sit still long enough to show the bands.


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## ABbuggin (Jun 18, 2008)

I'm still positive that they are not S. carolina. The thorax and abdomen of your female is much thicker than on any S. carolina I've seen. I've also never seen a yellow S. carolina, I've only seen green, grey, black, and a color I cant describe. lol (I'll post pics sometime). Your female just looks a LOT "beefier" than a S. carolina. How long is she by the way?

EDIT: I just got an idea. Seeing that all the possibilities of what your mantids could be, are of the same genus, it is possible for them to have of cross bred. Maybe, you just happened to pick up a cross bred species? Just an idea.


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## galapoheros (Jun 19, 2008)

Going by info Hypoponera posted also, it's not S. carolina like you said. Seems too odd to me that it would be a xbred species but I don't know, seems to be S. limbata. One fell while molting several days ago. If I remember, the wing was half yellow and half black ...maybe more yellow than there was black. I'll get a better pic of the wings sooner or later. Here are some more pics. Oh and the fems are around 2.5 inches.


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## galapoheros (Jun 21, 2008)

I decided to work at getting a wing pic. Typical S. limbata wing pattern? OK well thanks everybody, I think I'm through with this one.


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