# P. Wahlbergii nymphs have been dying off



## pedro92 (May 24, 2008)

About 5 or so nymphs have died off in the last few days they hatched a week ago. I have been feeding them and they are lookin good but then ocassionally i see one on the ground dead why is this


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## mrblue (May 24, 2008)

how many do you have? do you keep them together? what temp/humidity? what food?

really hard to say without more details. assuming temp and humidity are fine... if you keep lots together, sometimes there are a few that arent quite as eager/agressive and miss out on the food you give them, especially if there isn't an excess of food, or if the container is too big. maybe this is the case?


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## pedro92 (May 24, 2008)

Im not sure of temps i will need to tell you temps late. Humidity was prolly to low. maybe about 40% i redid the humidity. Also there in a 32 oz deli cup from rebecca with humidity foam and bamboo skewers. I will throw in more food. I have 5 cups and 6 nymphs in each. I remade more cups with excelsior instead of sticks.


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## mrblue (May 24, 2008)

Chameleonare said:


> Im not sure of temps i will need to tell you temps late. Humidity was prolly to low. maybe about 40% i redid the humidity. Also there in a 32 oz deli cup from rebecca with humidity foam and bamboo skewers. I will throw in more food. I have 5 cups and 6 nymphs in each. I remade more cups with excelsior instead of sticks.


humidity is not usually a big problem unless moulting is involved. i doubt the temperature is wrong either as it would have to be pretty cold for them to die from it and i doubt it is. are you giving them d.hydeii? maybe trying d.melanogaster might help. however it might also be the case that these are just the weaker few from that ootheca. it is quite common to lose a few hatchlings before second instar.


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## Al&Nathan (May 25, 2008)

I have an egg case of Chinese mantis produced approx. 80 nymphs hatching 2 weeks ago. The first week, about 10 of them died. I kept track on all accountable bodies, and thus far, I have 25 died. I even found dead ones after they molted into L2 nymph. I figure it is the law of "survival of the fittest". By the way, I do feed and keep them well. I have tried two types of housing: First, all of them in one 12 x 12 butterfly container, and second, three in one 8oz container. I found bodies in both housings. I figure that the weak ones will die no matter what. My policy is that I do not sell or purchase L1 nymphs, even new L2 are very risky. What is my fellow experts' experience? Species to species, what % would you say is the mortality or survival rate?


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## pedro92 (May 25, 2008)

Alan Chien said:


> I have an egg case of Chinese mantis produced approx. 80 nymphs hatching 2 weeks ago. The first week, about 10 of them died. I kept track on all accountable bodies, and thus far, I have 25 died. I even found dead ones after they molted into L2 nymph. I figure it is the law of "survival of the fittest". By the way, I do feed and keep them well. I have tried two types of housing: First, all of them in one 12 x 12 butterfly container, and second, three in one 8oz container. I found bodies in both housings. I figure that the weak ones will die no matter what. My policy is that I do not sell or purchase L1 nymphs, even new L2 are very risky. What is my fellow experts' experience? Species to species, what % would you say is the mortality or survival rate?


Well chinese and p.w are two totally different mantids. They both require different conditions. I am not sure what the highest mortality rate is. I just hear p.w's are a tricky species.


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## pedro92 (May 25, 2008)

mrblue said:


> humidity is not usually a big problem unless moulting is involved. i doubt the temperature is wrong either as it would have to be pretty cold for them to die from it and i doubt it is. are you giving them d.hydeii? maybe trying d.melanogaster might help. however it might also be the case that these are just the weaker few from that ootheca. it is quite common to lose a few hatchlings before second instar.


I am and have been using d. melanogaster FF. I just will put alot more FF in there to ensure all of them eat.


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## macro junkie (May 25, 2008)

are u misting enough?


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## mrblue (May 25, 2008)

@ alan chien

_Tenodera_ seem to be pretty notorious for high mortality rate, i have never kept them myself but have read many many posts pretty much identical to yours ("my ootheca hatched out loads of nymphs, but they keep dying for no reason that i can think of"). i have no idea why this is so, but just thought i would mention that your experience is not uncommon. it wouldbe hard to say what the mortality rate for each species is everyone keeps their mantids so differently, someone providing far from ideal conditions and having a high mortality may be more likely to blame it on the "high mortality of the species" than their own shortcomings. however, to me it seems species with higher hatch rates sem to have a higher mortality, while species with lower hatch rates seem to hatch more robust nymphs, and mortality is lower. this is not a fact! its just the way it seems to me. although, maybe it is due to how much more dificult it is to give adequate care to 100+ hatchlings than it is to give adequate care to, say, 20? hard to say right?

@ chameleonare

i would not say _P.wahlbergii_ are tricky at all, i think it may just be a case of a few weaker ones dying naturally. i guess the only things to do would be ensure theres definitely enough food for them all (as you are doing) and maybe up your misting (i dont know how often youre doing it now though). i think once you get them to second instar you'll se they are fairly easy to keep and probably wont get (m)any more unexplained deaths.


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