# Unknown species from Madagascar



## Precarious (Jul 27, 2012)

Can anyone identify this species?

They are very gangly - all legs. I believe these are only L3 but already 1.5" long. You can see there are black markings on the raptors and that the final section of the raptor is short similar to grass mantis species.


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## ShieldMantid1997 (Jul 27, 2012)

very cool, how did you end up with it?

Sadly i have never seen one like this, reminds me of your salmon girl you posted about.


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## gripen (Jul 27, 2012)

It looks like a Solygia sulcatifrons. If so than you are one lucky man!


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## brancsikia339 (Jul 27, 2012)

Looks like brunneria, but brunneria's aren't found there. I'm thinking Solygia


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## brancsikia339 (Jul 27, 2012)

Where'd u get it? I'm positive it's a Solygia sulcatifrons after researching them


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## gripen (Jul 27, 2012)

brancsikia339 said:


> Where'd u get it? I'm positive it's a Solygia sulcatifrons after researching them


I would like to know that too.


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## stacy (Jul 27, 2012)

sure love the eyes


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## Precarious (Jul 27, 2012)

brancsikia339 said:


> Where'd u get it? I'm positive it's a Solygia sulcatifrons after researching them





gripen said:


> I would like to know that too.


Oh, I'm sure you would! :shifty: They were a gift from someone who wishes to remain anonymous. Sorry.

I wouldn't be so sure they are Solygia sulcatifrons. I don't see any markings on the raptors of Solygia sulcatifrons. Also, Solygia sulcatifrons have bumpy textures on their carapace, especially around the neck. They absolutely have the same build so quite possibly something in the Solygia family.


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## gripen (Jul 27, 2012)

Precarious said:


> Oh, I'm sure you would! :shifty: They were a gift from someone who wishes to remain anonymous. Sorry.
> 
> I wouldn't be so sure they are Solygia sulcatifrons. I don't see any markings on the raptors of Solygia sulcatifrons. Also, Solygia sulcatifrons have bumpy textures on their carapace, especially around the neck. They absolutely have the same build so quite possibly something in the Solygia family.


hmmm sounds like you speak from experience...


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## Precarious (Jul 27, 2012)

gripen said:


> hmmm sounds like you speak from experience...


Nope, just going by photos online. I've always wanted Solygia sulcatifrons though.


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## gripen (Jul 27, 2012)

Remember the markings may develop. I would not rule it out yet.


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## psyconiko (Jul 27, 2012)

Tenodera sp.


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## Precarious (Jul 27, 2012)

Nikkko said:


> Tenodera sp.


  I sure hope you're wrong. Never saw raptor markings like that. And they look longer than Tenodera with even shorter tips on the raptors.


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## gripen (Jul 27, 2012)

Precarious said:


> I sure hope you're wrong. Never saw raptor markings like that. And they look longer than Tenodera with even shorter tips on the raptors.


Actually he could be right. Look at the markings in the forelegs.


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## Precarious (Jul 27, 2012)

gripen said:


> Actually he could be right. Look at the markings in the forelegs.


You mean the outside of the raptor? I've never seen a photo of any Tenodera species with black dots like that on the inside. The most I see is two dark smudges. If you know something I don't please hook me up with a photo or link.

I guess we'll have to see what happens next molt.

Randomly collected Tenodera raptor photos...


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## gripen (Jul 27, 2012)

The inside of the raptors. Could be tenodera superstitiosa.


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## MantidLord (Jul 27, 2012)

Hi,

*If *this is Tenodera sp. then I guess some do have black markings on the inside.

http://www.marsnjak....ic=545&amp;type=pic

Oops, forgot you said from Madagascar :blush:


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## gripen (Jul 27, 2012)

MantidLord said:


> Hi,
> 
> *If *this is Tenodera sp. then I guess some do have black markings on the inside.
> 
> ...


That is a statillia sp.


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## MantidLord (Jul 27, 2012)

Thanks, my friend in China asked me what it was, at first I assumed Tenodera but the black markings through me off.

Now back to the mystery mantis.


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## Precarious (Jul 28, 2012)

gripen said:


> The inside of the raptors. Could be tenodera superstitiosa.


I'll have to take your word for it. I can't find any images of that species' inner raptors.

In the mean time I'll hope it's some Solygia species. And while I'm at it, that adults grant three wishes and lay golden ooths filled with rubies. :sorcerer: Yeah! That's the ticket!


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## gripen (Jul 28, 2012)

Precarious said:


> I'll have to take your word for it. I can't find any images of that species' inner raptors.
> 
> In the mean time I'll hope it's some Solygia species. And while I'm at it, that adults grant three wishes and lay golden ooths filled with rubies. :sorcerer: Yeah! That's the ticket!Hehehehe good luck with them!


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## brancsikia339 (Jul 28, 2012)

Could be tenodera but ive raised t. Sinensis for years and none looked like that. Maybe add a thesprotia sp into the mix


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## guapoalto049 (Jul 28, 2012)

I found some T. superstitiosa in Tanzania but I can't remember if they have black marks like that. Will check my pics later, but I hope it is Solygia!


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## guapoalto049 (Jul 28, 2012)

Do you have any better pictures of the face?


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## Precarious (Jul 28, 2012)

guapoalto049 said:


> Do you have any better pictures of the face?


I'm tied up today but that's the next thing on the agenda. I know their face is more like Brunneria than the classic mantid face. I'll also get closeups of that last abdominal segment since Solygia has an overhang as they mature. May not be visible yet but should be some indication of what's to come if it is Solygia.


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## guapoalto049 (Jul 28, 2012)

Yeah all projections take awhile to show. Take a look for horizontal stripes on the face, while this obviously isn't a clear indicator of anything, it would be another factor to point in that direction.

I am almost positive it is a Solygia sp. Horizontal stripes on the eyes (not sure about the face), relatively short tibia compared to the femur, body proportions, etc. Don't quote me on it though


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## Precarious (Jul 29, 2012)

guapoalto049 said:


> Do you have any better pictures of the face?


I think it's too early to ID these nymphs but here are more photos. Nothing conclusive. I should try to sex them since I believe only female Solygia have the extended last segment.


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## guapoalto049 (Jul 29, 2012)

Nice shots! Only time will tell, and yes I think you're right about the female.


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## Termite48 (Jul 30, 2012)

Henry: I believe I have four of the same species. I see with my 7X loop and through the plastic 80 oz container sides (somewhat blurry), at least two black spots on the inner aspect of the upper portion of the raptorial. I also faintly can see a dark to light to dark banding on the inner section of the middle legs. There are no hints of green color as with Tenedora sp. Mine are possbily L-4 to L-5 and very long at this point, at perhaps 1-1/2".

Rich


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## Termite48 (Jul 30, 2012)

Henry: I examined one of mine closely from the underside (Ventral view) and I noticed a front to rear running whitish strip along the mid-line from the middle pair of legs to the rear set of legs. This might be another characteristic that we can use to make a positive I.D. Let me know if yours shows the same stripe. It is not brightly colored.


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## gripen (Aug 21, 2012)

Any updates?


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## Precarious (Aug 21, 2012)

gripen said:


> Any updates?


Molted. Now over 2" and reddish.








Rich S said:


> Henry: I examined one of mine closely from the underside (Ventral view) and I noticed a front to rear running whitish strip along the mid-line from the middle pair of legs to the rear set of legs. This might be another characteristic that we can use to make a positive I.D. Let me know if yours shows the same stripe. It is not brightly colored.


We got them from the same source so we can assume they are the same.


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## Termite48 (Aug 21, 2012)

Of the two I have remaning, neither of them has this coloration. They are over 2" in length, one is more greenish, and one is more on the brown side. They are different containers, but eating wild caught green bottle flies and an occasional Sarcophagid species. Ones epecially likes to be totally laid out with its raptorials stretched all the way horizontal. One likes to have its long body bent at the natural hinge point, the other keeps it straight. Nice pic showing the lateral whitish stripe.


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## gripen (Aug 21, 2012)

Wow they are stunning! Do you have any more full body pictures? Do you think you at least have a pair?


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## psyconiko (Aug 21, 2012)

I am still thinking it is a Tenodera sp.Any ideas?


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## Precarious (Aug 21, 2012)

Rich S said:


> One likes to have its long body bent at the natural hinge point, the other keeps it straight.


Rich be careful if the body looks crimped. The body should bend like a banana but if there is a sharp fold in the body it will likely have a bad molt. That's what happened to mine. The other is also creased so I'm watching it closely to assist during molt. I've only ever seen this happen with Brunneria borealis, another long-bodied species. In the wild they tend to hang at an incline but in deli cups they hang at the highest point which is horizontal. This causes the carapace to crease while still soft and can lead to constriction causing blockage and death or getting stuck during molt.



gripen said:


> Wow they are stunning! Do you have any more full body pictures? Do you think you at least have a pair?


Of the 3 I have I lost one to a bad molt. No idea on sex yet. The other is preparing for molt.

Here are more photos of the Pink Panther!


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## psyconiko (Aug 21, 2012)

:cowboy:


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## Precarious (Aug 21, 2012)

Nikkko said:


> I am still thinking it is a Tenodera sp.Any ideas?


No idea. I know there is a pinkish red species of Solygia but these show none of the horizontal stripes on the face. Check out the last photo above.


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## brancsikia339 (Aug 21, 2012)

It's a solygia. Here's a pic from another site


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## Precarious (Aug 21, 2012)

brancsikia339 said:


> It's a solygia. Here's a pic from another site


I'm aware of it. This is the species I mentioned above but they are still not showing the bumpy textures or characteristic horizontal stripes on the face. I would love for them to be Solygia but I'm thinking they may not be.


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## gripen (Aug 21, 2012)

I am sure it is tenodera presub.


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## Precarious (Aug 21, 2012)

gripen said:


> I am sure it is tenodera presub.


Have you seen these colors in tenodera?


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## psyconiko (Aug 21, 2012)

Solygia does not have this head/mouth shape.


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## psyconiko (Aug 21, 2012)

Is there a green line under its abdomen?


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## psyconiko (Aug 21, 2012)

Solygia


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## gripen (Aug 21, 2012)

Look at the inside of the raptors and the striping on the wing buds.


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## Termite48 (Aug 21, 2012)

Henry: As usual the pics are great. In color only not in morphology, they are quite different, yours and mine. I believe you are correct in making the observation about the crimp in the body at the start of the abdomen. It looks like future disaster. The things that I see that are the same in color or markings are that mine also has retained the two spots on the middle of the raptorials. The antennae look identical. There may be a pinkish blush present with my good one, but there is a distinct difference in the color and patterns of color of the eyes. From the front, the eyes have an emerald green band that joins the two eyes. I wish I had access to a camera, but my step-daughter who is in modeling, has confiscated the only camera that is working. I was hoping to have a pic to send, but she being here today told me that she left it in N. Hollywood, where she lives and works mostly

I hope to stay in touch with you about these mantids from our source. I believe that time will tell if, in fact, they are a rare species and if they are even the same species. It seems weird that they could be so identical morphologically and not at all in color. I think I have two males. 

Yours truly,

Rich


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## Precarious (Aug 22, 2012)

Nikkko said:


> Solygia does not have this head/mouth shape.


Agreed. Completely different. Solygia is very distinct. Thought they might develop into that shape but I'm not seeing it.



Rich S said:


> It seems weird that they could be so identical morphologically and not at all in color. I think I have two males.


I know. I really do seem to get odd colors in most species I keep. Still trying to figure that one out. I don't know if it's all the extra humidity I give or that I raise everything at room temp. They were more common shades until the last 2 molts. Looks like the other remaining nymph will be the same color if it survives.


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## brancsikia339 (Aug 22, 2012)

I wonder what kind of tenodera it could be. Probably superstitiosa


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## gripen (Sep 13, 2012)

Any adults yet?


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## brancsikia339 (Sep 13, 2012)

gripen said:


> Any adults yet?


+1


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## MandellaMandy123 (Oct 5, 2012)

gripen said:


> Any adults yet?


+1


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## Precarious (Oct 5, 2012)

gripen said:


> Any adults yet?





brancsikia339 said:


> +1





WolfPuppy said:


> +1


I've got a ton of photos to go through and process before posting, but here are two teaser shots of the adult female who just molted a few days ago...


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## agent A (Oct 5, 2012)

oh! ah! so cool!!!!


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## angelofdeathzz (Oct 5, 2012)

Beautiful mantis the color is amazing! I think the scientific name is "rhubarb mantis"....


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## agent A (Oct 5, 2012)

angelofdeathzz said:


> Beautiful mantis the color is amazing! I think the scientific name is "rhubarb mantis"....


Rhuemomantis precariocious


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## Precarious (Oct 5, 2012)

angelofdeathzz said:


> Beautiful mantis the color is amazing! I think the scientific name is "rhubarb mantis"....


The closest species I can find are Tenodera australasiae or Tenodera superstitiosa but it's neither of these.

I've been calling it Tenodera precariousa (aka Pink Panther Mantis).


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## slytle90 (Oct 5, 2012)

Wow that is one beautiful mantis!


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## Bug Trader (Oct 5, 2012)

It could be a Tenodera subspecies new to us all, It wouldnt be the first, I know a couple people with new and even unnamed species.Good luck with it.


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## bobericc (Oct 6, 2012)

the contrast between the eyes on the face is crazy.. best looking tenodera i've ever seen..


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## gripen (Oct 6, 2012)

bobericc said:


> the contrast between the eyes on the face is crazy.. best looking tenodera i've ever seen..


Yes she is so elegant and graceful.


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## brancsikia339 (Oct 6, 2012)

Precarious said:


> The closest species I can find are Tenodera australasiae or Tenodera superstitiosa but it's neither of these.
> 
> I've been calling it Tenodera precariousa (aka Pink Panther Mantis).


love it! that is the coolest tenodera species i've ever seen!!!! Hopefully you'll breed them!


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## shoejazz (Oct 8, 2012)

Nice photos, beautiful mantis.


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## chrisnoahdana (Nov 15, 2012)

Mine are adult now I'm glad rich and Henry had luck too they are not anything like solygia sorry for the late reply as I've had solygia in the past I also hope there not hard to mate as solys were a pain in the neck a very shy sp Very lol I won't bother with solys anylonger !


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## Sublime64tothe42 (Nov 30, 2012)

Any updates?


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## Precarious (Nov 30, 2012)

Sublime64tothe42 said:


> Any updates?


Culture is deal. First male died without connecting. Second male was too afraid to try and eventually got eaten. Very very slim chance he connected when I wasn't present but don't hold your breath. Female has still not laid ooth indicating to me she's holding back until mated, which ain't gonna happen.


:angel:​


*R.I.P.*
​


Tenodera precariousa
​


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## Mime454 (Nov 30, 2012)

here's to parthenogenesis!


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## minard734 (Nov 30, 2012)

NOOOOOO! Gotta get more, Prec  . Gotta! I'd be interested in paying money for THESE!  ...


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## Precarious (Nov 30, 2012)

Ryan Minard said:


> NOOOOOO! Gotta get more, Prec  . Gotta! I'd be interested in paying money for THESE!  ...


Not much I can do. Apparently the others who got them didn't care enough to raise them to adult. Only Rich S had a male he was nice enough to send. I will be unveiling another new species very soon. Way cooler, in my opinion.

Soon...


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## Paradoxica (Nov 30, 2012)

OOOOH, I can't wait


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## brancsikia339 (Dec 1, 2012)

Can't wait! Poor tenodera precariousa


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## Mime454 (Dec 1, 2012)

Precarious said:


> I will be unveiling another new species very soon. Way cooler, in my opinion.


You sound like God or something.


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## Malakyoma (Dec 1, 2012)

Mime454 said:


> You sound like God or something.


I'd accept Precarious as my god. Where should we build the temple?


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## Precarious (Dec 1, 2012)

Mime454 said:


> You sound like God or something.


Unveiling into culture, not into the world. Wish I could do that!



Malakyoma said:


> I'd accept Precarious as my god. Where should we build the temple?


Send all donations in cash, gold, silver, diamonds and rubies, or make checks payable to 'cash'.


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## GhostYeahX (Dec 1, 2012)

tenodera fasciata


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## fleurdejoo (Dec 1, 2012)

Ima send somethin' all right!


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## Precarious (Dec 5, 2012)

fleurdejoo said:


> Ima send somethin' all right!


Are you sending more dirty laundry? :huh:


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## Precarious (Dec 5, 2012)

She laid the first ooth yesterday morning. Weird looking thing. I don't have much hope it will hatch.


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## hierodula (Dec 5, 2012)

Whoa! she looks really big in that pic. How big is she?


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## Precarious (Dec 5, 2012)

hierodula said:


> Whoa! she looks really big in that pic. How big is she?


Just under 4".


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## fleurdejoo (Dec 5, 2012)

2 words Doo Dee


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## Precarious (Dec 5, 2012)

fleurdejoo said:


> 2 words Doo Dee


That's your answer to everything. :angry:


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## fleurdejoo (Dec 5, 2012)

That's my answer to you!


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## Precarious (Dec 5, 2012)

fleurdejoo said:


> That's my answer to you!


Must I wash out your mouth with soap and send you to your room? The spanking certainly didn't seem to help...


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## Christian (Dec 8, 2012)

That was _Tenodera superstitiosa_. Colors don't matter.


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## Precarious (Dec 9, 2012)

Christian said:


> That was _Tenodera superstitiosa_. Colors don't matter.


Good to know. I trust your word. Thank you.


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## Mime454 (Dec 9, 2012)

Will you have any opportunity to get more? I know that you don't want to divulge your source, but can you tell us that?


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## Precarious (Dec 9, 2012)

Mime454 said:


> Will you have any opportunity to get more? I know that you don't want to divulge your source, but can you tell us that?


These were given to me by someone in the US. They didn't get them bred either. I don't know if he can get more.


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