# How many of your nymphs usually survive?



## wangi (Apr 27, 2010)

Hi all,

I don't seem to be having much success raising nymphs. Out of 8 mantids I've tried to raise from 2/3 instar, 2 have survived to adulthood and even then 1 mismoulted so his front leg was bent. Since my early days I have begun to mist them every day and provide much better ventilation in their cages. But my last batch of nymphs, of which there were 5, is now down to 2 nymphs (1 with a bent foreleg due to a mismoult, despite being misted all the time and having sticks etc to moult on) and 1 adult. Oddly enough the adult is the Hymenopus coronatus which are supposed to be a little harder to look after than Alalomantis coxalis which are the other 2.

2 of my nymphs have died from a strange blackness on the tips of their abdomens which makes the abdomen go all floppy. It looks like a fungus of some sort. I thought it might be not enouigh ventilation but this morning one of my lively little nymphs had the same thing despite being well ventilated.

Is this just a normal success rate and I'm over reacting to their deaths, or do you think there's something I'm doing wrong?


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## hibiscusmile (Apr 27, 2010)

Hi Maria, so hard to tell what is happening to them, what species are the others? What kind of water and sprayer are u using? What are u feeding them? One thing I have noticed is that if it is a little to wet every day on them, they will develope a fungus or bactaria that will kill them, they need water, but u have to be careful to not overspray, I squirt about 3 sprays in a container and the strength of the spray is based on the size of the container, if u can understand what I am trying to say, like the amount of pressure used to tighten a bolt, the same applies when spraying, a light spray for samll area, a heavier spray for bigger area. Hows the temps too?


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## PhilinYuma (Apr 28, 2010)

It's hard enough to be a Sassenach on the wrong side of the Wall without losing 75% of your nymphs as well!

Alalomantis muta is not much (if at all) kept over here, but Tier has raised them and may be able to help you.

How much you spray should be governed by the ambient humidity. Do you have a hygrometer, or can you borrow one from the museum?

I realize that you are an experienced insect keeper, but while you are working out the best way to raise your mantids, it wouldn't be a bad idea to get, say, ten nymphs of one "easy"species and raise them in individual pots. get as much advice as you can from the seller. If you are spritzing daily and find that you are still having problems, cut down the spritzing on half of them to every other day or so and see which does better. You can use this simple technique to "fix" all sorts of variables.

I shall light a candle before the shrine of the Great Mantis Goddess (Blessed be Her Name) for you. Good luck, and keep us up to date.


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## wangi (Apr 28, 2010)

Hibiscusmile,

The first 3 mantids I raised were all Creobroter gemmatus. One survived to adulthood with wings bent, 1 was given to a friend but died (I presume of cold, he was keeping it in a cold flat) and another died of the black abdominal fungus. At the time I was on holiday and keeping him in a pint glass and I expect it was too wet and not enough ventilation, so since then I changed my methods.

The recent batch of mantids were 1 Hymenopus coronatus, 4 Alalomantis coxalis. The H. coronatus has survived to adulthood and is doing swimmingly well on fruit flies and the occasional small cricket (it is a male, only an inch long). Of the 4 A. coxalis, 1 is doing really well at an inch and a half long and killing everything you put near it. 1 has mismoulted and has a wonky forearm so must be hand-fed. 1 died very early indeed, was fine one day then next day he was all weak and floppy and dead - no idea why. The other died yesterday of the black abdomen tip.

The water I am using is normal tap water in a plant sprayer. There are no toxins or anything in the water unless it's all the ###### our government puts in there. The water is used on all the animals and has never been a problem for mantids we have got from sub-adult, scorpions, frogs, spiders, stick insects or anything else. I will try to spray them less, as I usually give them a good spray to try and keep a high humidity. It's been a cold winter and low humidity, I guess I have got used to drenching them.

All the mantids have been started on Drosophila then moved up to crickets when big enough. The Drosophila is from the genetics department and reared on broth, the crickets are from a live food supplier and are fed fruit and vedge (I am decreasing the amount of vit A they're getting in case it's too much), mouse cake, fish food and fresh dead mouse.

Walking into the museum is like being hit by a gentle wave of warmth - it's usually 30 degrees or more in there. I'm going to try spraying them as you describe, that black abdominal thing certainly did look like it might be fungal. A. coxalis don't need as much humidity as H. coronatus anyway, or so I have read.

PhilinYuma, I think this is actually the correct side of the wall for me!  

I don't have a hygrometer, I will see if there is one lurking around. That's an interesting experiment. I'm away for a month or so but when I get back I will see about getting 10 nymphs and trying that. Hopefully the temps will be up by then so I can keep them in my flat.

Thanks very much for the advice guys, it must make yez cringe to see fumbling beginners killing all their mantids.


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## hibiscusmile (Apr 28, 2010)

I think the water may be causing a lot of your problems. Try less like u said and we don't cringe, we get used to it, otherwise we would be flat by now!


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## Orin (Apr 30, 2010)

What does your caging look like? With such a small number of animals it could be a terrible run of bad luck or a superbly unique disease but most likely it's a husbandry issue. Depending on the time frame of the deaths it's possible they were damaged when you bought them.


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## wangi (May 3, 2010)

Orin said:


> What does your caging look like? With such a small number of animals it could be a terrible run of bad luck or a superbly unique disease but most likely it's a husbandry issue. Depending on the time frame of the deaths it's possible they were damaged when you bought them.


Hi Orin, I don't think they were damaged when I bought them - they survived a few moults and I got them from a good place. I expect it is my husbandry and I've been spraying less since posting here. My cages are critter keepers, plastic with lots of ventilation. Some are kept on spider soil and others on kitchen roll. My most successful mantids have been kept in a jar which I modified by making a hole in the lid and gluing mesh over it, I think the humidity is ideal in there. I have a big problem with the critter keepers in that they seem to be easily dropped and the lids come off easily - I expect they may be poor quality ones. I have dropped them a couple of times and learnt to be careful!!


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## tier (May 6, 2010)

Hi

Phil, you wrote I bred _Alalomantis muta_ and may help. Right. But in this thread, they are talking of _Alalomantis coxalis_. Christian and I am telling the wolrd since several month that _Alalomantis coxalis_ is not _Alalomantis coxalis_, and not even a _Alalomantis_, but _Sphodromantis_, in detail: _S._ cf. _aurea_. Nowbody cares, most stick to the wrong name. Desana and Gurd from UK should be most experienced in raising _S._ cf. _aurea._

Hence, I cannot help. The black abdomen/fungus is usual if animals are kept to hot or to humid or both.

regards,

Stefan


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## hibiscusmile (May 6, 2010)

I concure, that humidity causes it, not that I know the species, but moist air sometimes does a lot of damage, especially moist stagment air, no breeze in most of our containers.


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## ismart (May 6, 2010)

How often do you clean your enclosures?


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## hibiscusmile (May 6, 2010)

Were u askin me or them? I clean mine every thursday! :tt2:


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## Chief Tom (May 12, 2010)

I started out with well over 100 giant chinese mantids. I let over half of them go and kept the rest. I kept good care of them, but I think I over misted them and then some of them started to get a black fungus or some kind of parasite on them. I had to turn most of them loose in order to keep it from spreading. Some of them I was able to clip the fungus/parasite off with fine tweezers. I agree with hibiscusmile, I think the problem was overly misting them. I have 7 left and they are doing very well.


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