# Bare Net Cage



## massaman (Sep 3, 2009)

Well my chinese female molted in the bare net cage last night and noticed one of her back legs was twisted badly and was pretty much useless and had to amputate it and wonder if as long as she can move around on her other good legs would missing one leg be a problem for a bigger mantis species? Did not think it could happen in a net cage and nothing was in it to disturb her either so have no idea what went wrong so anyone else have any adults that had the same thing happen to them?


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## Rick (Sep 3, 2009)

She should be fine. Things like that can go wrong no matter what you do.


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## Katnapper (Sep 3, 2009)

Bare net cage mismolts happen to me too, Paul. You'd think it wouldn't... but like Rick said, sometimes it just happens.


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## massaman (Sep 3, 2009)

well problem is she cant really walk at all right now without that one leg that had to be amputated (the leg was cut to where the small part meets the big part) and tried to put her in another different cage with thick branches and she tried to climb them and just fell off them and landed on the tank bottom and trying to figure where to put her so she can harden but not sure what to do and put her back in the net cage but she cant climb cause of the loss of the leg so I am in a quandry here!


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## Katnapper (Sep 3, 2009)

I'd put her back in the net cage and hope for the best. We just can't cure everything.


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## massaman (Sep 3, 2009)

true but am just about to give up on this species if this dont work its just not a pleasant experience trying to do what you can and your left with little or nothing to show for the effort or attempted effort and I have easier luck on smaller species I had and have right now and its just the larger the species the more heartache it can bring if things go wrong!She is in the net cage now but looks so helpless unable to climb anything and lying on the bottom but shes still alive but just sad to see what mismolts can do to the ones you want to use to breed!

 This is so depressing and if she cant climb then there is little hope of her ever going to lay any ooths if she does recover from the amputation and she does look ok but without that back right leg she is almost as bad as saying shes a cripple!


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## ismart (Sep 3, 2009)

Katnapper said:


> Bare net cage mismolts happen to me too, Paul. You'd think it wouldn't... but like Rick said, sometimes it just happens.





Katnapper said:


> I'd put her back in the net cage and hope for the best. We just can't cure everything.


The problem is the bare net cage. it has no humidity holding substrate. Chinese mantids need at least 60% humidity for them to moult properly. The amount of humidity will be the same as the room you keep them in. Even if you mist twice a day it's not going to make a difference if the mantis moults after the water has totally evaporated in between mistings. I only keep adults in bare net cages. Trust me if you put some moist paper towel at the bottom of the net cages it can make all the difference.


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## AmandaLynn (Sep 3, 2009)

So did she just molt? You mentioned she still needed to harden but kept falling. If you are handling her and amputating limbs before her exoskeleton has hardened that could also be the cause of the problem. Lack of humidity could be the cause of her leg being twisted but she should still be able to hold on with her other legs.


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## Katnapper (Sep 3, 2009)

ismart said:


> The problem is the bare net cage. it has no humidity holding substrate. Chinese mantids need at least 60% humidity for them to moult properly. The amount of humidity will be the same as the room you keep them in. Even if you mist twice a day it's not going to make a difference if the mantis moults after the water has totally evaporated in between mistings. I only keep adults in bare net cages. Trust me if you put some moist paper towel at the bottom of the net cages it can make all the difference.


I guess I didn't think to mention it.... thanks, Paul! I use a cut-to-fit layer of paper towel in the bottom of all my cages. And the ones that need more humidity, I either spray the heck out of the paper towel, or sometimes (usually) just take my water bottle and go around pouring some water through the top so that it soaks the bottom of the paper towel layer. Works well.


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## massaman (Sep 3, 2009)

it was too late to save the one leg it was twisted too badly and was just dangling and i did not want to have to harden like that and cause the mantis problems if any so did the amuputation and now just letting her recover in a smaller critter keeper for now at least!


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## ismart (Sep 3, 2009)

Katnapper said:


> I guess I didn't think to mention it.... thanks, Paul! I use a cut-to-fit layer of paper towel in the bottom of all my cages. And the ones that need more humidity, I either spray the heck out of the paper towel, or sometimes (usually) just take my water bottle and go around pouring some water through the top so that it soaks the bottom of the paper towel layer. Works well.


That is exactly what i do!


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## massaman (Sep 3, 2009)

My only other concern is now that she has had that leg amputated is it still possible for a large mantis to move around with two good front legs and 1 and half legs on the back being half of her right leg was left after the amputation


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## massaman (Sep 3, 2009)

I guess the other good thing is though I had no problems with my europeans just this chinese female was all!


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## massaman (Sep 3, 2009)

I guess the other good thing is though I had no problems with my europeans just this chinese female was all!The only problem is where the net cage is sitting getting the bottom wet would ruin the wood of the entertainment center it was resting on and its nice to know now that paper towel is what was needed but kind of too late to use it now though!


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## Katnapper (Sep 3, 2009)

ismart said:


> That is exactly what i do!


  :lol:


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## ismart (Sep 3, 2009)

massaman said:


> I guess the other good thing is though I had no problems with my europeans just this chinese female was all!The only problem is where the net cage is sitting getting the bottom wet would ruin the wood of the entertainment center it was resting on and its nice to know now that paper towel is what was needed but kind of too late to use it now though!


Just place a pastic bag under it, or something that the water won't seep through.


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## Katnapper (Sep 3, 2009)

ismart said:


> Just place a pastic bag under it, or something that the water won't seep through.


Layer of plastic (or plastic bag) with some bath towels on top of that... underneath the cage. The towels will soak up any leakage, and the plastic will make sure it doesn't go down to your entertainment center. Then just change the towels out when needed.

In my bug room it's all carpeted, and I don't worry about it.... I just let it leak on to the carpet and evaporate, lol.


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## ismart (Sep 3, 2009)

Katnapper said:


> Layer of plastic (or plastic bag) with some bath towels on top of that... underneath the cage. The towels will soak up any leakage, and the plastic will make sure it doesn't go down to your entertainment center. Then just change the towels out when needed.In my bug room it's all carpeted, and I don't worry about it.... I just let it leak on to the carpet and evaporate, lol.


Kat, just be carefull no mold is growing under the carpet. I remember whatching on T.V. some guys face getting eaten by mold!  He wears a plastic face piece to cover his growtesk looking face! Poor guy.


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## AmandaLynn (Sep 3, 2009)

massaman said:


> it was too late to save the one leg it was twisted too badly and was just dangling and i did not want to have to harden like that and cause the mantis problems if any so did the amuputation and now just letting her recover in a smaller critter keeper for now at least!


So she is able to hold on now? That is good! I would still wait until the rest of her exoskeleton hardens, even if the leg was obviously useless, handling them when they are still soft usually does more harm than good.


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## massaman (Sep 3, 2009)

Here is what she looks like







hoping she looks little better then this!


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## massaman (Sep 3, 2009)

yes she can hold on to things starting now but i think she may come out of this a little traumatized though


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## PhilinYuma (Sep 3, 2009)

ismart said:


> That is exactly what i do!


Me too. Just finished doing it, in fact!


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## Katnapper (Sep 3, 2009)

ismart said:


> Kat, just be carefull no mold is growing under the carpet. I remember whatching on T.V. some guys face getting eaten by mold!  He wears a plastic face piece to cover his growtesk looking face! Poor guy.


  Ewwww.... are you serious? lol :huh:


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## ismart (Sep 3, 2009)

Katnapper said:


> Ewwww.... are you serious? lol :huh:


Yes! :lol: Well granted it was an extreamely rare case, but it scared the bejesus out of my girl! :lol: 

back to the topic.

She really does not look to bad. I don't think her wings will get any better though. Let her rest for a few days so she can regain some strenght.


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## massaman (Sep 3, 2009)

I am just worried that with only 1 back leg she may not be able to stand very well or if she climbs something she will be off balance because she lacks both back legs err she has one full back leg and about half of the other!She just looks like shes flat on the surface she is on and managed to get some big pieces of wood for her to lay on without having to climb anything and maybe she can just lay on the wood and recover or something!


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## ismart (Sep 3, 2009)

massaman said:


> I am just worried that with only 1 back leg she may not be able to stand very well or if she climbs something she will be off balance because she lacks both back legs err she has one full back leg and about half of the other!She just looks like shes flat on the surface she is on and managed to get some big pieces of wood for her to lay on without having to climb anything and maybe she can just lay on the wood and recover or something!


Just give her some time. She is clearly still weak. 3 legs is enough to support her own body weight.


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## massaman (Sep 3, 2009)

Trying out something as I moved her to a critter keeper and took out all the sticks and branches from in it so nothing but her and the floor so she can gain her strength and maybe put the sticks and stuff back in the cage in a day or two and would this be ok to do as everytime she tries to climb a branche or something she pulls herself halfway up and then falls over amd going to try this approach to see if this will work!She can crawl around in the keeper and will wait till she looks little better before putting any sticks or stuff back in to see if she has any strentgh first!


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## PhilinYuma (Sep 4, 2009)

massaman said:


> Trying out something as I moved her to a critter keeper and took out all the sticks and branches from in it so nothing but her and the floor so she can gain her strength and maybe put the sticks and stuff back in the cage in a day or two and would this be ok to do as everytime she tries to climb a branche or something she pulls herself halfway up and then falls over amd going to try this approach to see if this will work!She can crawl around in the keeper and will wait till she looks little better before putting any sticks or stuff back in to see if she has any strentgh first!


This is fine!


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