# I'm getting violins, but they seem impossible to feed!



## Mitch65009 (Jul 4, 2019)

Hey! I've been reading up a lot on violins,  and the more I read, the more challenging they seem to keep and feed. Like, how do you even feed FLYING FOOD?? It sounds crazy to me. Haha. Like, don't they get loose and fly through your whole house? And where do I even buy blue bottle flys?? There no where to be found! I wanted to keep 3-4 in a communal 10 gallon tank, but I'd have to put mesh around all the sides, right??

But anyways, that's the least of my worries, I just don't know how I'd feed them! Someone please give me ideas, thanks.


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## hysteresis (Jul 4, 2019)

https://www.rainbowmealworms.net/250-spikes-fly-larvae/

Ill be ordering up again in another week or two, if you want to split on shipping (and sometimes duties, depending on how they feel at the border).


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## Mitch65009 (Jul 4, 2019)

@hysteresis oh, so there's really no place around here that has those flys?? But when you feed them, how do you do it? It seems impossible.


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## hysteresis (Jul 4, 2019)

Mitch65009 said:


> @hysteresis oh, so there's really no place around here that has those flys?? But when you feed them, how do you do it? It seems impossible.


Well, you pupate and eclose flies for the older nymphs and adults. 

You can buy Black Soldier Fly larvae from the Windsor ON area but they cost just as much, and take longer to get to flies. 

Younger nymphs take hydei. 

You can also eclose wax moths from waxworms. 

Hand feeding gongys is brutal. If they dont accept it immediately at first presentation, they won't take it at all for a bit. 

You can try wax worms or meal worms in a shallower feeding cup with the gongy inverted, but thats still hit and miss.


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## Mitch65009 (Jul 4, 2019)

Man, okay. I saw this video a few mins ago on how to feed them. It's genius! 





But if I kept them in a tank, I wouldn't have the pluggable hole. Are the black soldier flys a similar size?


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## hysteresis (Jul 4, 2019)

Ohhh boy. Typical flies from smallest to largest. 

D. melanogaster / small ff (i1) 

D. hydei / large ff (i2/i3/i4) 

L. sericata / GBF (i4 on) 

C. vomitoria / BBF (i4/i5 on) 

Look at more videos. You can put your ff culture in the fridge to slow them down, but use a feeder cup that you sprinkle them into, theyll stay near the bottom of your 2nd cup if yiu tap the cup frequently on the table.


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## Mitch65009 (Jul 4, 2019)

@hysteresis oh, are they flightless?


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## hysteresis (Jul 4, 2019)

Mitch65009 said:


> @hysteresis oh, are they flightless?


Melano, yes. Hydei, effectively. 

The HF, GBF, and BBF are not. 

I skip HF and GBF and use BBF as they're tolerant of fridge temps.


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## Mitch65009 (Jul 4, 2019)

Oh I see. The shipping is pretty expensive for some flies. Haha.


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## hysteresis (Jul 4, 2019)

And then sometimes Canada Customs will assess duties on top. Hit and miss.


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## Mitch65009 (Jul 4, 2019)

@hysteresis no wayy, really?? I can believe there's no shop that carries them around here.


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## hysteresis (Jul 4, 2019)

You can get ff at reptile stores usually. 

Im surprised stores dont sell BBF spikes or pupae for chamelions.


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## Mitch65009 (Jul 4, 2019)

Yeah, I see fruit flys a lot. But I need BBF. Lol


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## Jaywo (Jul 4, 2019)

This may sound gross but sometimes when I run out of flies and I'm in a bind, I rip a mealworm in half and let my big Violin taste the goo. They always take it afterwards but they have to be used to seeing the tweezers or they tend to bat it away.


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## Mitch65009 (Jul 4, 2019)

@Jaywo yeah it is kina gross. Haha. But i didnt know mantids didnt like certian tweezers?? Cause ever since i got a better pair of tweezers, my mantis just wont eat from them.


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## hysteresis (Jul 5, 2019)

I use a wooden skewer that i've hot glued a piece of stiff wire to. I rip the feeder open, Skewer it lightly, and present this prey item with the low-profile instrument of my design. Unobtrusive. But, Gongys are a$$e$ about this kind of thing and if he doesn't take it on first presentation, he wont take it at all. I have to try later.


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## hysteresis (Jul 5, 2019)

@Mitch65009, throw in with me, and maybe another Canadian or two from  the "Canadian Mantis Connection" group, and we'll order BBFs together. Split the shipping and duties, if they asses them at import. Only way you'll get BBFs. Alternatively, google a way to catch flies in a trap outside. Even try culturing them yourself in the summer.


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## Mitch65009 (Jul 5, 2019)

Yeah, I probably order them with you sometime. I don't think Id ever be able to catch them. Lol


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## hysteresis (Jul 5, 2019)

It's easy.


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## Mitch65009 (Jul 5, 2019)

@hysteresis really? You've done it before? I wouldn't even know how to breed them. Lol.


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## hysteresis (Jul 5, 2019)

@Mitch65009 google it. 

I haven't yet. I plan to, if it doesnt get too whiff.


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## Mitch65009 (Jul 5, 2019)

@hysteresis haha, I hear ya. I will definitely Google it though. Thanks.


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## MantisGirl13 (Jul 6, 2019)

I agree with what hysteresis has been saying, I just want to add a few things. First, a net cage is much better for violins due to great ventilation and mesh sides and it's much easier to feed them in there. Second, take into consideration what instar the violins you are getting will be. Violins power through flies, moths, and even bees in larger instars, so feeding gets expensive, especially in Canada. 

- MantisGirl13


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## hysteresis (Jul 6, 2019)

Hopefully have some gongy nymphs by end of week. Have flies so should go well.


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## Mitch65009 (Jul 8, 2019)

MantisGirl13 said:


> I agree with what hysteresis has been saying, I just want to add a few things. First, a net cage is much better for violins due to great ventilation and mesh sides and it's much easier to feed them in there. Second, take into consideration what instar the violins you are getting will be. Violins power through flies, moths, and even bees in larger instars, so feeding gets expensive, especially in Canada.
> 
> - MantisGirl13


Really? They sound a little complicated  haha. I don't know where I would get this stuff here, I'll do a little digging to figure out how I would feed them. But for the net cages, do I need to put any decor or something to keep the humidity? Wouldn't it just go though?


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## hysteresis (Jul 8, 2019)

@Mitch65009

On Amazon.ca... 

Search for butterfly habitat 

Search for insect habitat


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## MantisGirl13 (Jul 9, 2019)

Mitch65009 said:


> Really? They sound a little complicated  haha. I don't know where I would get this stuff here, I'll do a little digging to figure out how I would feed them. But for the net cages, do I need to put any decor or something to keep the humidity? Wouldn't it just go though?


They are a bit complicated for sure! Violins are a low humidity species so extra humidity isn't needed. 

- MantisGirl13


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## vyadha (Jul 12, 2019)

For your first species, Violins may be a bit tough if you’re trying to figure out how to feed them flies.

ghosts are awesome and much more tolerant of temps.

That said, i don’t have a ton of experience and my violins did fine. When i don’t have flies, the larger nymphs will eat roach nymphs


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## Teamonger (Jul 15, 2019)

Just going to throw in my two sense as someone that raised violins under stressful conditions.

BSFs are very easy to culture and if you do it right they will not smell and you can keep them anywhere in your house. There is a sticky from me on how to do that. I currently have my colony in the guest room and you would never know its there besides the noise of the flies.

Feeders are pretty much impossible to buy in Iceland where I live now and blow flies like BBF etc don't even seem to exist here. As in the dog poo in my yard never has flies on it and it is weird and frustrating for a mantis keeper. That said I had to rely almost completely on nothing but Hydei Fruit Flies to raise my violins and keep them alive even into adulthood. My oldest lived for a bit over a year and ate almost nothing but fruit flies her whole life unless I managed to catch some moths or crane flies outside occasionally.

So I would keep some fruit flies as an emergency means if needed since they seem to be more readily accepted then mealworms or anything else you try to shove into their little diva faces. I would certainly do everything you can to get bigger feeders but this might be a good back up so you don´t stress so much.


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## MantisGirl13 (Jul 15, 2019)

How do you feed an adult violin on only fruit flies?!?

- MantisGirl13


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## hysteresis (Jul 15, 2019)

One would think theyd need more nutrition. But if they eat 100 hydei, that's a snack, I guess.


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## Mitch65009 (Jul 15, 2019)

hysteresis said:


> One would think theyd need more nutrition. But if they eat 100 hydei, that's a snack, I guess.


Haha, 100?


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## hysteresis (Jul 16, 2019)

Adult gongys are a good size. 

I have half a dozen nymphs en route and an ooth waiting to hatch. 

If we lose the house, then you'll know they eat a lot.


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