# Random Orchid deaths?



## Ghost_Keeper (Nov 12, 2015)

So I had recently gotten some l2 orchid nymphs from Peter Clausen when they both suddenly died under the same circumstances. They stopped eating, became very hyper, and their abdomens swelled up and become dark black at the tips, with almost an opaque yellow for the rest. They ignored all food, and when given water or anything, their mouths wouldn't work. Any idea what happened with my nymphs? The only thing they ate was fruit flies btw.


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## Ghost_Keeper (Nov 12, 2015)

Please?


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## MantisMatt14 (Nov 12, 2015)

Looks like bloating, could be bacterial


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## mantisman 230 (Nov 13, 2015)

Seems bacterial, how old is that culture?


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## Ghost_Keeper (Nov 13, 2015)

3 weeks old at most.


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## hibiscusmile (Nov 15, 2015)

I see this a lot, but we really do not know why it happens, how often were you misting them? What is their cage like?


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## PlayingMantis (Nov 17, 2015)

I've seen it before - the abdomens would get swollen, and the mantis would stop eating, slow down, and die.

It could possibly be due to a weakened immune system, or bad food (I fed mine only flies, but it could be possible the flies carried some bad bacteria?). For my second generation of orchids, I tried keeping them drier and more ventilated. I still saw it happen in 1-2 nymphs but overall the percentage of deaths did go down.


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## Ghost_Keeper (Nov 17, 2015)

I misted them twice a week, living in 32 oz deli cups with good ventilation, no substrate and minimal decor. These were l3 at best. Hopefully we can figure what causes this. Has this been seen in any other species? If not it might just be hereditary..


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## Ranitomeya (Nov 18, 2015)

I've never seen this happen, but I never mist their containers or them directly. They get their moisture by drinking from the piece of paper towel I hotglue to the bottom of their lids for gripping when I wet it every couple of days. The rest of their moisture comes from their food and the sugar solution I provide them with. I keep them humid without actually keeping their containers moist and when I do wet the paper towel on the lid, it dries within hours--if condensation is capable of forming within a container, the ventilation within the container is not at all as good as you think it is.


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## Ghost_Keeper (Nov 18, 2015)

The water dried within an hour to 30 minutes with their tanks, keeping them humid was a problem.. Up until this, they were very active and voracious. My eldest orchid is sub and just glares at me until I hand him a cricket


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## Deacon (Nov 23, 2015)

Ranitomeya,

What sugar solution? Just for orchids? How do you provide this? Just curious because I hadn't read anything about sugar solution before this.

Nancy


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## Ranitomeya (Nov 23, 2015)

Mantises like sweets and probably do better if provided with some source of carbohydrates. Some people use honey, I use a sugar solution that's about 50% sugar and 50% water.

I use sugar water because mantises are more likely to come into contact with sugars in the form of nectar in the crops of their prey than honey, which is made and stored within a beehive. I'm also hesitant to use honey because of the chance of residual "bee-safe" pesticides that are really only safe for honeybees and have varying affects on other bee species and insects. Even if it doesn't kill our pets, it may be enough to reduce their lifespans or render them incapable of reproducing.


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## Deacon (Nov 25, 2015)

Ranitomeya,

Thanks for that info. I take it you use an eye dropper then...is this a daily or weekly treat?

Nancy


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## Skandocious (Sep 24, 2016)

Hate to bump this, but as an FYI, the breeding stock of orchids in the US, has a lot of hereditary problems, due to inbreeding and limited genetic stock. 

However yours seems most likely to be bacteria. I would keep the humidity in check.


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## Orin (Sep 25, 2016)

I don't think anyone has kept them enough generations to see the results of inbreeding. Orchids are not easy to breed and fly media is a soup of bacteria.


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## hibiscusmile (Sep 25, 2016)

I have Orin and I can tell you they go maybe 5 times with inbreeding and after that nothing. 5 times would be lucky.


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## PIaf94 (Oct 1, 2016)

It's actaully really hard to inbreed orchids. Especially if they are from the same ooth. Males would mature much faster than females. Sometimes a month in advance and slowing the males isn't really ideal. most breeders trade or sell off mature males for younger ones. Back to the subject. I've never had this happen with with orchids L2 and older but I've had some thing happen similar to many L1 nymphs in the past. Through trial and error I've found that yes food can be the problem. I've seen this mainly when I fed  melanogaster flys, especially ones near the end of their culture or when there wasn't much ventilation in the container.  Signs included constant wondering. Bloated abdomen and excretion of black to orang or red liquid from the abdomen or mouth. You won't always see this but you can tell it's happening if you see these colored dried splotches around the sides of the terrarium or substrate if you use paper towel


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