# Communal ghost mantis enclosure



## Deanmachine (Feb 9, 2015)

Hi there,

I'm new to the mantid hobby, first just want to say it's always interesting finding a new weird tiny group of excited folks. I've cared for tarantulas for about 1 1/2 years now, and that community seems massive compared to this one! I just stumbled upon mantids the other day and they seem really interesting, and certain species seem fairly easy to care for (compared to tarantulas which I'm used to.)

I've done some research and it seems I am interested in ghost mantids since they are a good beginner species and can possibly live communally. From what I've gathered on this forum, even though they CAN live communally, a lot of people seem to have stories of cannibalism. Of course I don't want this to happen, but I would still like to try to house two, possibly three together if possible.

I have an arboreal tarantula enclosure that I made a while back, sadly Samsung the avic died 6 months ago. The enclosure is 7" x 7" x 12" tall, I've attached a photo. I like the look of this thing, honestly I'm just not a big fan of deli containers or those hex jars...just not for me.

So a few questions after all that talk:

1. Is this enclosure too big for an L2-L3 ghost mantis? I will probably feed with tongs by hand, not just let prey loose in there and get lost

2. Is this enclosure big enough to house 2 or three ghosts into adulthood without issue? or is this a terrible idea? Would it just be survival of the fittest?





Any and all advice is appreciated! Thanks :scooter: 

-Dean


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## CosbyArt (Feb 9, 2015)

Hello Dean and welcome to both the hobby and forum





Here is the dedicated caresheet for Ghost mantises (Phyllocrania paradoxa). Most of the data is pulled straight from there. Also there has been many discussions on this in the past, you can use the search function to find more information too.

1. Many people like to house mantises in large habitats, and most do knowing the problems with feeding. The best way to solve the problem is to remove the mantises to a smaller habitat during feeding time, and put them back afterwards.

Regarding the tong feeding method some mantises do fine, while others will refuse and become offended by having food shoved in their faces (and can starve) - it really depends on the individual mantis.

2. Although they can be kept communal as nymphs it is recommended to separate them at the pre-sub adult instar stage, or L5.

The typical habitat size recommended is 2 to 3 times the adult mantis in length/width/height. As Ghost adults can reach 2" that is 4" to 6" in size, and with the 7" size that habitat would work great for one mantis, two would be too tight, and three would be a disaster. Even communal species need room to move around and be "by themselves" to prevent cannibalism, stress, and such.


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## dmina (Feb 9, 2015)

Deanmachine said:


> Hi there,
> 
> interesting finding a new weird tiny group of excited folks.
> 
> -Dean


Hey I resemble that remark... some might be insulted.. but I understand..





Welcome and looking forward to hearing more from you...


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## Jay (Feb 9, 2015)

Dear Dean,

Welcome to the forum!

This has got to be one of the best hobbies!

As I have much of the same fears I am currently keeping my ghosts separated by gender and giving them a little room.

Your container looks really neat, though you will definitely need to modify it a bit (i.e. some kind of surface to molt from on the top) to make it mantis-ready.

My home-made containers have worked great so far. Hopefully my subadults will moult safely to adult!

I have had a terrible time attempting to feed mine by hand - they would prefer to eat "on their own" and, in fact, when I attempt to watch them dine they will sometimes stop eating and look at me in a "would you please excuse me" kind of way until I back off a bit. My Ghosts prefer flying insects more than anything else.

Again - Welcome and thanks for joining us!


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## Peter Clausen (Feb 10, 2015)

Mantises are a lot like tarantulas (but without venom, and that you can hold in all cases, and that don't fall into the "pet hole in the ground" category, and with eyes and head movements that are so much more relatable). Like tarantulas they are relatively still until they attack, although watching them feed is personally much more interesting for me to watch. I've had thousands of both groups of bugs. You're really going to enjoy mantises. Your poor Avic! It looks too small to have died so soon. I've got an A. versicolor that I've had for 8 years that would love your tank, though it would web it up so good and so quickly and destroy all the clarity and decor that make that tank so spectacular.  Welcome!

You may want to wet that substrate down really good when you introduce your mantises to it. The cage is just a tad airy.


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## kingmantissupply09 (Feb 10, 2015)

I would go with a WAY smaller enclosure for about 2 molts after L3, I recommend you take a peak at my instructional decorative mantis habitat http://mantidforum.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=34785#entry277711 

Let me know if it helped


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## Deanmachine (Feb 11, 2015)

Thanks so much for all the responses! Very helpful  I'll update on my progress soon


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