# are there any mantids that...



## Frankie Fan (Mar 4, 2007)

i've read on the net that some Mantids (females obviously) lay ready fertilized Ooths. is this true or i it just made up and if it is true which species lay ready fertile Ooths?


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## robo mantis (Mar 4, 2007)

Do you mean without being mated? If so then yes some mantids lay fertile eggs without being mated.


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## Jodokohajjio (Mar 5, 2007)

No males of the species Brunneria borealis are known to exist in captivity. The ooths that the females lay will hatch without being fertalized by a male. I believe that they can be found in the southern/western US.


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## OGIGA (Mar 5, 2007)

Hmm, if the females exist in captivity and she lays an ooth that hatches, then you'll get females and males, right?


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## Rick (Mar 5, 2007)

There are no males at all.


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## Jodokohajjio (Mar 8, 2007)

> Hmm, if the females exist in captivity and she lays an ooth that hatches, then you'll get females and males, right?


A male would have to fertilize the eggs in order to produce males. This is the reason:

Females have two X chromosomes ("XX") while males have an X and a Y ("XY"). When a female produces asexually, it is like she is fertilizing her own eggs with her own DNA, so getting a Y chromosome would be impossible without intervention or fertilization. You might remember doing this little chromosome pairing thing if you've ever taken a basic biology class:

X X

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X|XX|XX|

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Y|XY |XY|

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X X

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X|XX|XX|

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X|XX|XX|

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There is a 50/50 chance of getting a male/female in the first one, but in the second, there is no chance of getting a male.


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## Rick (Mar 8, 2007)

But with that species there are no such thing as males.


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## Frankie Fan (Mar 8, 2007)

the giant asian manrtis doesnt lay ready fertile eggs does it?


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## humantis (Mar 8, 2007)

Per Wikipedia's Hierodula mem. page -

"Sexual... very limited parthenogenesis abilities"


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## Rick (Mar 8, 2007)

> the giant asian manrtis doesnt lay ready fertile eggs does it?


No not at all.


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## the mantinator (Mar 16, 2007)

> No males of the species Brunneria borealis are known to exist in captivity. The ooths that the females lay will hatch without being fertalized by a male. I believe that they can be found in the southern/western US.


cant be true. I think this would be a male because it has wings and females don't. Not a grass mantis im sure

http://bugguide.net/node/view/97581


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## randyardvark (Mar 16, 2007)

what? to produce offsping the individial has to be female, thats what men cant do, any nymphs produced from parthegenesis is effectively a clone of the female i do believe as there is no other genetic material for the female to use other than her own


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## yen_saw (Mar 18, 2007)

> the mantinator Posted: Fri Mar 16, 2007 7:47 pm Post subject: Jodokohajjio wrote:
> 
> No males of the species Brunneria borealis are known to exist in captivity. The ooths that the females lay will hatch without being fertalized by a male. I believe that they can be found in the southern/western US.
> 
> ...


I have never seen a male Brunneria Borealis, while it may exist in the wild, the pic in bug guide was taken from Argentina so it might be of another species. The following link also show a brunneria sp from South America which resembles the Northern American stick mantis (B. Borealis)

http://ttwebbase.dyndns.org/mantid/view/43.html


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