# Stick insects as mantis food?



## Meiji (Jul 27, 2008)

Does anyone have any experience with raising stick insects as mantis food? I am thinking of cultivating _Carausius morosus_ or something for this purpose. I know they reproduce more slowly than crickets, but they're also cleaner and might climb the enclosure walls where mantises can find them.


----------



## Morpheus uk (Jul 27, 2008)

Meiji said:


> Does anyone have any experience with raising stick insects as mantis food? I am thinking of cultivating _Carausius morosus_ or something for this purpose. I know they reproduce more slowly than crickets, but they're also cleaner and might climb the enclosure walls where mantises can find them.


They reproduce far more than crickets, i know people, and occasion myslef who when they have too many stick insects may feed some to keep numbers healthy, but i wouldnt breed them just as mantid food as i read somewhere that they are not that good a food source nutrition wise or something


----------



## chrisboy101 (Jul 27, 2008)

i thought theyd be the best nutrition


----------



## idolomantis (Jul 27, 2008)

i would never do that


----------



## obregon562 (Jul 27, 2008)

for years i had a colony of just "stick bugs" that reproduced in population explosions! numbers wise, it should work, but im not sure on nutrition wise.


----------



## The_Asa (Jul 27, 2008)

I agree, I wouldn't try it just for fear of malnutrition.


----------



## hibiscusmile (Jul 27, 2008)

They remind me to much of the mantis


----------



## MANTIS DUDE (Jul 27, 2008)

hibiscusmile said:


> They remind me to much of the mantis


Yes, I wouldent do it either. But, some people feed therire crippled mantis to another mantis.  :blink:


----------



## idolomantis (Jul 27, 2008)

MANTIS DUDE said:


> Yes, I wouldent do it either. But, some people feed therire crippled mantis to another mantis.  :blink:


i would do.


----------



## Birdfly (Jul 28, 2008)

I use giant prickly stick insect nymphs for my lizards and mantids, because i have looooads of em but most would do nicely, provided they dont have a noxious defence.

They are nice and meaty but others would do as well.

They are a good fall back when my roaches and flies are low and can only be another good variety to my animals diet


----------



## Meiji (Jul 28, 2008)

Birdfly said:


> I use giant prickly stick insect nymphs for my lizards and mantids, because i have looooads of em but most would do nicely, provided they dont have a noxious defence.They are nice and meaty but others would do as well.
> 
> They are a good fall back when my roaches and flies are low and can only be another good variety to my animals diet


Thanks for the info Birdfly. I think I am going to try to make aphids and stick insects a part of the diet of my mantises. I live in an urban apartment and it's very important that I don't stink up the place with fly cultures, etc. Do you think the giant prickly is the best stick insect to culture as a food insect? If I kept a few healthy adults as pets what rate of reproduction can I expect? Thanks.


----------



## idolomantis (Jul 28, 2008)

lays up too 500 eggs each female.


----------



## obregon562 (Jul 28, 2008)

great info man! thanks a ton!


----------



## Birdfly (Jul 29, 2008)

Hi, no i think some thing a bit smaller like _Carausius morosus_ would be best for mantids, easier handled.

I only use the giant prickly coz a friend gave me, what seems like thousands of eggs, as they hatch and grow i feed certain sizes to my mantids and certain bigger sizes to my lizards.

They make interesting pets in their own right so i am keeping the largest males and females to start the whole thing going again.


----------



## Meiji (Jul 29, 2008)

Birdfly said:


> Hi, no i think some thing a bit smaller like _Carausius morosus_ would be best for mantids, easier handled.I only use the giant prickly coz a friend gave me, what seems like thousands of eggs, as they hatch and grow i feed certain sizes to my mantids and certain bigger sizes to my lizards.
> 
> They make interesting pets in their own right so i am keeping the largest males and females to start the whole thing going again.


I agree. I raised C. morosus about ten years ago and they are cute and fun to feed. Where do you recommend I get eggs to get started again?


----------



## Peter Clausen (Jul 30, 2008)

Hi Meiji,

Stick-insects do not make sense as feeders for mantises. First, they take months to incubate. Second, they grow more slowly than crickets. Third, they are uninteresting to mantises because of the way they move (or don't move, actually). Finally, the hobby has already shown that flies, roaches and crickets are the more superior feeders. If stick-insects were a viable feeder more people would be doing it. I raise a couple phasmid species, but attempting to feed them to mantises is mostly a waste of time. Only newborn nymphs are active enough to capture a mantis' attention. At that point they really aren't much of a gutload for any mantis large enough to be unitimidated by all the legginess.

Stick with the various sizes of flies, feeder roaches and home-raised crickets.


----------



## pohchunyee (Jul 30, 2008)

MANTIS DUDE said:


> Yes, I wouldent do it either. But, some people feed therire crippled mantis to another mantis.  :blink:


I feed crippled/disfigured mantis (mismoult) to my chameleon.


----------



## Meiji (Jul 30, 2008)

Peter said:


> Hi Meiji,Stick-insects do not make sense as feeders for mantises. First, they take months to incubate. Second, they grow more slowly than crickets. Third, they are uninteresting to mantises because of the way they move (or don't move, actually). Finally, the hobby has already shown that flies, roaches and crickets are the more superior feeders. If stick-insects were a viable feeder more people would be doing it. I raise a couple phasmid species, but attempting to feed them to mantises is mostly a waste of time. Only newborn nymphs are active enough to capture a mantis' attention. At that point they really aren't much of a gutload for any mantis large enough to be unitimidated by all the legginess.
> 
> Stick with the various sizes of flies, feeder roaches and home-raised crickets.


Yeah, you're right of course. My creative ideas have led me down a path of trouble in the past and probably will in the future as well!


----------



## Birdfly (Aug 1, 2008)

Peters right, they arent the best foods, i only use them as i have so many.

Roaches, flies etc are a better, faster breeding bet and all that i mostly rely on although i personnally feed my predators all i can find, buy or raise.

A bit off topic but food for thought? if you'll excuse the pun  perhaps even a thread of its own?

Nutritionally though i fail to see why they are inferior, mantids (unlike lizards, T's etc) usually reject their preys stomach contents, especially herbivours, the "good gut loading" we like to have for our carnivorous pets and their prey is important but for mantids i believe its more on a cellular level ie a roache eating say a proprietory gut load or meat, fruit and veg is replacing its cells with good, undamaged, unprocessed foods and converting its flesh into a healthier meal for a predator unlike a roache that has been starved in its box for a long time then given some thing nice to eat a few days before it is in turn eaten by a mantid, it hasnt had time to replace its inferior meat and so a mantis is not getting the rewards??

any thoughts on this one?


----------



## Peter Clausen (Aug 1, 2008)

Our feeder crickets, house flies and fruit flies are not necessarily that healthy themselves, but their health doesn't seem to affect the health of our mantises to any degree that I've ever been able to notice.

Fruit flies eat medium.

Flies often the same.

Who knows what pet store crickets eat (not sure I want to know).

I never feed my roaches meat for fear of starting a harmful bacterial or fungal culture in my home. My roaches get a healthy mix of leftover fruits, vegetables and grains from my dinner table. My phasmids eat between one and three plants, depending on what species they are.

Phasmids are a good supplement for a mantis if you have extras and can get the mantis to show some interest in the phasmid. But (your) time and energy-wise, they are not a good investment as a feeder for mantis.


----------



## Birdfly (Aug 1, 2008)

Peter said:


> Our feeder crickets, house flies and fruit flies are not necessarily that healthy themselves, but their health doesn't seem to affect the health of our mantises to any degree that I've ever been able to notice. Fruit flies eat medium.
> 
> Flies often the same.
> 
> ...


Hi Peter, I think between them its that we look after these feeders and the fact that we offer at least this variety that makes a difference to our mantids etc, Well looked after crickets (even though we have more of a problem with them in Europe, it seems) are better but not the solution.

I have (within the last 4 months approx) beeen offering my roaches meat (in the form of cat presants, field/house mice, voles etc in small amounts) they are eaten before any thing has a chance to go bad, i also offer lamb bones/bones which are gnawed on.

My roaches hover between moist and dry kept (depending mostly on foods offered as to substsrate miosture levels), small amounts of mold appear but are eaten before they cab build up.

Phasmids, yeah, imo just a good suppliment, not worthy of long term mantid food, best as a suppliment like treats as with other exotic foods, wildies etc... treats if you will, if you have  variety is the spice of life and good enrichment, even for an invert predator


----------



## Peter Clausen (Aug 2, 2008)

Hey, If I didn't have options I might eat phasmids too!


----------



## Birdfly (Aug 2, 2008)

Well weve seen crickets and mealworms deep fried and dipped in chocolate :lol:


----------

