# Female ghost mantid is laying othca



## Tonypace2009 (Feb 2, 2016)

My female ghost mantid is about 5 weeks mature and as of Monday my male is 2 weeks mature.I put them together last night for a few hours but the female wasn't to receptive she climbed all over the enclosure with him on her back. I am sure they didn't couple up. This afternoon she is laying her first otheca and am pretty sure it is in fertile. So my question is when should I try to breed them? Should I wait a couple days or longer?


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## jseng (Feb 2, 2016)

I would wait a week, making sure to feed the female a ton (adult male Ghosts don't really eat much, but you can try feeding him as well) before you try pairing them up again.


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## Tonypace2009 (Feb 2, 2016)

jseng said:


> I would wait a week, making sure to feed the female a ton (adult male Ghosts don't really eat much, but you can try feeding him as well) before you try pairing them up again.


Thanks The female is no trouble to feed but the male has little interest in food even a fluterering moth stuck up to his mouth. I will try again in about a week.Moderators fell free to delete second post I tried to in edit. My mantids are not cooperating and neither is my web browser sorry for double post.


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## Tonypace2009 (Feb 12, 2016)

Well I reintroduced my male to my female ghost mantid and he got on her back and she started climbing all over the enclosure . Several times it seems as though she was trying to kick him off so after a couple hours I separated them. Is this normal behavior from the female? This is my only male ghost mantid I have not witnessed them conected. My question is should I keep separating them when the female shows this behavior or leave the male in enclosure and hope for the best. This is the the female that laid the  infertile otheca about February 2nd at least I am 98 percent sure its in fertile I never saw them connected and only left the room a couple of times for a few short minutes both times they were put together .  The male is over 3 weeks matured. And the female is about 6 weeks matured. Any feedback appreciated


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## jseng (Feb 13, 2016)

Sounds like she's about to lay an (infertile) ooth. I would separate them until she does, then feed them both for a week or so, making sure she gets nice and plump again, and try to reintroduce them later on down the line.


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## Tonypace2009 (Feb 13, 2016)

jseng said:


> Sounds like she's about to lay an (infertile) ooth. I would separate them until she does, then feed them both for a week or so, making sure she gets nice and plump again, and try to reintroduce them later on down the line.
> 
> She isn't wasting anytime the other infertile ooth was about  10 days ago I guess timing is everything. They are already separated  the way she was acting last night I couldn't risk my only male.  I had another male that would have matured 1 week before the female  but never accomplished his molt  he fell at the start of his molt and couldn't hang right to molt. This male has no interest in food  he even refused a fluterering moth.I have been getting him to drink water but no food.he will accept water from a seringe is there any kind of liquid food they may take? Thanks for the help


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## jseng (Feb 13, 2016)

Male ghosts don't eat very much in general, but if you want him to have some sustenance before trying to get him to perform again, you could try taking a prey item (I use blue bottles or Turkestan roaches), pull off its head and use tongs put the gooey end to his mouth. If he's at all hungry, he'll probably snatch it out of your tongs and begin munching. Alternatively, if that is too gruesome for you, you could mix some honey and/or bee pollen with some water and use a dropper to have him drink it. I actually do that with all my adult mantids anyway, and few can resist.


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## jseng (Feb 13, 2016)

Another thing that I've found increases receptiveness to mating in both male and female mantids is heat, so I will usually place both mantids in an extra warm room or under heat lamps for about an hour before placing them together.


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## Tonypace2009 (Feb 13, 2016)

jseng said:


> Another thing that I've found increases receptiveness to mating in both male and female mantids is heat, so I will usually place both mantids in an extra warm room or under heat lamps for about an hour before placing them together.


My female ghost is climbing all over the enclosure today most likely looking for a place to lay a  second in fertile ooth. I will warm them up ahead of time next time.  Thanks for the tip


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## Tonypace2009 (Feb 22, 2016)

I tried introducing my male ghost day 7 after my female ghost laid her second in fertile ooth the male was ready  but the female took off runing with him trying to grab on. Apparently the male has lost the ends of his front two toes on his front legs and the ends of the toes on his raptor's. He keeps trying to climb all over his enclosure but just keeps falling. Does the female always take off runing when the male tries to climb on or is there a time when she will stop and let him on. Day 8 I tried giving the female a cricket while letting the male climb on didn't work she isn't hungry. Without being able to climb the male is to clumsy to climb on her fast enough. Is there some kind of sign to look for when the female is ready? I thought day 7 was perfect the female refused food and she is plump but when the male tried to climb on she was out of there. I warmed them up an hour before introducing them both times day 7 and 8. How many ooths does a female ghost lay on average? The female is climbing all over her enclosure now like she has in the past before she lays a ooth 8 days after the last. I don't know how much longer my poor male is going to make it.


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## Tonypace2009 (Feb 23, 2016)

My female ghost mantid laid her 3rd infertile oothecae 30 minutes ago exactly 9 days after the last. If my female is unreceptive to the male because she is already producing her eggs then how early should I introduce the male before she starts producing her next eggs? Should I try to introduce my male 3 or 4 days after she lays her ooth instead of 7 days? Why is she laying so often? She is a aggressive eater I feed her twice a day . She finally turned down food day 7 (from previous ooth) the tempature in my room averages 74 degrees and I do not have controlle over house thermostat so lowering tempature is not an option. From my understanding you shouldn't introduce the male until the female turns down food is this right? Has anyone else experienced this situation with ghost mantids?


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## Kermit (Feb 23, 2016)

I agree increase the temperature, have pre feed and have unlimited food supply in the enclosure, then add misting them both. That usually will do the trick... If prefeed and unlimited food in enclosure I have had no instances of cannibalism... Of course it's always possible. But you have to weigh the effort and energy expended to watch them as my experience is that it tends to take up to 24 hrs for the hook up and many times it happens in the first hours of the morning.... I let the food supply dwindle once and a male got munched. Another time I let food supply dwindle for a day and one female munched the other female (no male present)... Try adding misting and heat... Tends to start the process.


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## Tonypace2009 (Feb 23, 2016)

Kermit said:


> I agree increase the temperature, have pre feed and have unlimited food supply in the enclosure, then add misting them both. That usually will do the trick... If prefeed and unlimited food in enclosure I have had no instances of cannibalism... Of course it's always possible. But you have to weigh the effort and energy expended to watch them as my experience is that it tends to take up to 24 hrs for the hook up and many times it happens in the first hours of the morning.... I let the food supply dwindle once and a male got munched. Another time I let food supply dwindle for a day and one female munched the other female (no male present)... Try adding misting and heat... Tends to start the process.


I will try misting also .My biggest problem is the male can't seem to climb since he is missing his front right toe . He is trying to climb but keeps falling and she stays more toward the top of the enclosure. So as of now about all I can do is place him on her back and hope she gives him a few seconds to latch on. If she wasn't runing around full speed trying to scrape him off of her  I am pretty sure he could manage. I guess my plan is to feed her real heavy for 3 days then feed her and try putting the male on her while she is eating.I will have several feeders ready and keep feeding her. If she goes after him I will remove him and try again day 5. 

I also had a talk with her about the bird and the bees. But she just looked at me looking for a bee to eat.?


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## Kermit (Feb 24, 2016)

Ha-ha! Yeah I am anxious too and tend to put the male on the female's back. It's safer than letting him try the sneak attack... Lol. If she's well fed she shouldn't work too hard to get him off. I just did this about a month ago with my ghosts and he ride around for 2 days on her back and the she laid her ooth with him on her back.... Not sure they connected. He got off on his own then managed to get on the second female and was there for 2 days.... Then back to the first female again... That's when I let the unlimited food supply down a bit... He tried to go back to #2 again and she ate him.... I was waiting for my flies to hatch and #1 female munched #2... I ended up with 6 ooths in total between the 2 females. I know at least a couple should be fertilized. Eta on hatch should be mid March... Experimenting with just breeding the largest black ghosts of the last hatch. Looks like Darth Vader!!! 

Keep me posted on your efforts.

Heat and misting should trigger them to go into heat.

Good luck

Erik


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## Tonypace2009 (Feb 24, 2016)

Kermit said:


> Ha-ha! Yeah I am anxious too and tend to put the male on the female's back. It's safer than letting him try the sneak attack... Lol. If she's well fed she shouldn't work too hard to get him off. I just did this about a month ago with my ghosts and he ride around for 2 days on her back and the she laid her ooth with him on her back.... Not sure they connected. He got off on his own then managed to get on the second female and was there for 2 days.... Then back to the first female again... That's when I let the unlimited food supply down a bit... He tried to go back to #2 again and she ate him.... I was waiting for my flies to hatch and #1 female munched #2... I ended up with 6 ooths in total between the 2 females. I know at least a couple should be fertilized. Eta on hatch should be mid March... Experimenting with just breeding the largest black ghosts of the last hatch. Looks like Darth Vader!!!
> 
> Keep me posted on your efforts.
> 
> ...


My female was Green and turned light tan her last molt. I guess it's tuff being a male mantid.My guy is so banged up there is no way he could climb fast enough to sneak up on the female he doesn't seem to realize he lost the tip of his front leg he keeps trying to use it and keeps falling. Heat and misting. Thanks hopefully this puts her in the mood. Are there pictures of the black ghost mantid?


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## Kermit (Feb 24, 2016)

Super Black "Vader" Project... Top males and females selected!

View attachment 6998


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## Tonypace2009 (Feb 24, 2016)

Kermit said:


> Kermit said:
> 
> 
> > Super Black "Vader" Project... Top males and females selected!
> ...


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## Kermit (Feb 25, 2016)

Ghosts are one of the best!


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## Tonypace2009 (Feb 25, 2016)

Kermit said:


> Ghosts are one of the best!


I know this is why I have to succeed at getting ootheca full of them.


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## Tonypace2009 (Mar 1, 2016)

Well 6 days since last in fertile ooth been feeding female heavy  misted added heat  and will leave my male in with her tonight. My male is worse shape than I thought after examination he only has toes or his claws on two legs one front and one back. He really can't climb hardly any thing he keeps falling so I had to make a breeding box out of a large USPS priority box screened in two sides added some fake leaves and vines for him to hide in. But not really sure he will be able to get the job done. He can lock onto a branch  he just can't climb it. At this point I am just going to let nature take its course  hopefully by some miracle he can get the job done. I don't really see a point in separating them any more I really don't think he is going to last another week .It's really sad watching him trying to fullfil his duties in the shape he's in. So she will kill him or he will succeed or he will succeed and she will kill him rather way he has to be a mantid.

I seem to have bad luck with ghost males.


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## DeShawn (Mar 1, 2016)

I have like 10 males that I don't need.  Let me know if you need a few.


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## Tonypace2009 (Mar 1, 2016)

DeShawn said:


> I have like 10 males that I don't need.  Let me know if you need a few.


Thanks for helping me out. I need my female to atleast produce one fertile ooth and I will be a happy camper.


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## jindarose (Mar 4, 2016)

*TEACHER NEEDS ADVICE*:  Today in the classroom, we introduced an adult male ghost and a  mature female _(had already laid an ootheca a week ago)__ to one another._

He approached and hopped on her back_ (much to the 6th graders astonishment!)_, she tried to get him off, but he held on.  *An hour later she started laying another ootheca (unfertile, obviously) and he is parked on her back* - I'm not sure what to do about the situation.  

Will she be very hungry right after laying an egg ? Would she be likely to eat him?  

He is firmly attached to her back and I am not sure I could remove him safely with her busy laying an egg right now, _(I don't want to disturb her process_).  I suppose I could watch carefully, and try to remove him from the cage as soon as she is done laying the egg case?


Note:  this means me taking the cage with me to my other classes, and try to intervene as soon as she is finished laying the infertile ootheca. _(but I really don't want that kind of distraction in my 7th grade math classes today...mantis sex would just be TOO much for pubescent 13yr olds to manage)_

Should I just put a bunch of flies in the cage and hope they are easier prey for her than attacking him?  

Thanks for any advice!


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## Tonypace2009 (Mar 4, 2016)

I removed my male before my female laid her ooth. She was reaching around to grab the male and I only had the one male so I had to separate them. I am just learning myself first time breeding mantids. This is what Kermit had to say about introducing them.



Kermit said:


> Ha-ha! Yeah I am anxious too and tend to put the male on the female's back. It's safer than letting him try the sneak attack... Lol. If she's well fed she shouldn't work too hard to get him off. I just did this about a month ago with my ghosts and he ride around for 2 days on her back and the she laid her ooth with him on her back.... Not sure they connected. He got off on his own then managed to get on the second female and was there for 2 days.... Then back to the first female again... That's when I let the unlimited food supply down a bit... He tried to go back to #2 again and she ate him.... I was waiting for my flies to hatch and #1 female munched #2... I ended up with 6 ooths in total between the 2 females. I know at least a couple should be fertilized. Eta on hatch should be mid March... Experimenting with just breeding the largest black ghosts of the last hatch. Looks like Darth Vader!!!
> 
> Keep me posted on your efforts.
> 
> ...


His male jumped off on his own but there was a second female involved. Being that you are most likely on a time limit that you can monitor them.

If you have them in a decent size enclosure where if the male can get away from the female throw a few feeders in and check on them at the end of the day. He might just jump off or at least you can separate them later. My female goes into relax mode after laying her ooths. She is definitely hungry the day after laying ooth. If you elect to leave them together make sure she has food.


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## jindarose (Mar 4, 2016)

UPDATE on Teacher needs advice:

I dumped a dozen BB flies into the cage before leaving for class - I've just come back for lunch and found he is still hanging on, she is finishing up her egg case (making the antenna-looking thing) and she is currently eating a fly!

What have we learned?


females seem to lay egg cases about every week or so

yes, she is hungry after she lays an egg

Males are very patient, even in the face of frustration - observation:  this is not true for all organisms

So:  I think he has a chance, if he can figure out how to get off her back...


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## Kermit (Mar 5, 2016)

Keep feeding her as that is what makes up the material the oothecas are made of and will lower the temptation for her to go after the male. If you've witnessed the "connection" you can use a kabaab skewer and he should step right up otherwise leave him on her back and keep adding blue bottles. Yes about every week she will make another ooth if she has filled her abdomen. If she eats less the ooth will just be shorter! When in doubt... Add BB flies. Tony... You got it now... Close to pro! Ghost Rider!


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## Tonypace2009 (Mar 10, 2016)

Update

My female has finally been mated actually witnessed them connected for about 2 hours on 03/06/2016 and today 03/09/2016 she has laid her first fertile ooth this afternoon.

Thanks to DeShawn for sending me some males you really helped me out and thank you Kermit for your advice it worked like a charm once I got a male up to the job. Also thank you jseng for your help.

What I have learned female ghost can lay first ooth 6 weeks  after mature.

Make sure you have several males and a good idea to have a couple of females too.

Feed female very well  I feed mine for 4 days after her last in fertile ooth she was fairly plump by this time.

Keep female steady supply of food while she cohabitates with males.

I put two males in with female (the two oldest males) 

I warmed the mantids and misted them to trigger mating. One male found hiding spot to I guess to ambush female but the female wasn't moving anywhere. The second male headed straight for her he was on her back in less than 45 minutes and rode on her back until they connected at 2:30 PM   until about 4:21pm just short of two hours.

My female laid her ootheca 3 days later. Now to wait  about 8 weeks for nymph's to emerge.?


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## Sarah K (Mar 10, 2016)

Congrats Tony!


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## Tonypace2009 (Mar 10, 2016)

Sarah K said:


> Congrats Tony!


Thank you

 Have you successfully paird yours yet?


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## Sarah K (Mar 10, 2016)

I just received my mantids from DeShawn yesterday afternoon. Yesterday evening, I put  my male together with the new female and the new older male from DeShawn. I have not witnessed any mating yet, but I suppose they could have done it while I was asleep.  The remaining female I had previously just laid another infertile ooth on Tuesday, so she is not ready yet. I am trying to get her fattened up a bit before I introduce her to the cage with the males. The other male DeShawn sent is still too young. **Fingers Crossed** I will have some confirmed luck to report after this weekend!


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## Kermit (Mar 10, 2016)

Congratulations to both of you... Fun to see!


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## Tonypace2009 (Mar 10, 2016)

Sarah K said:


> I just received my mantids from DeShawn yesterday afternoon. Yesterday evening, I put  my male together with the new female and the new older male from DeShawn. I have not witnessed any mating yet, but I suppose they could have done it while I was asleep.  The remaining female I had previously just laid another infertile ooth on Tuesday, so she is not ready yet. I am trying to get her fattened up a bit before I introduce her to the cage with the males. The other male DeShawn sent is still too young. **Fingers Crossed** I will have some confirmed luck to report after this weekend!


I fed my female pretty heavy for 3 days by the fourth day she was really plump. Started warming enclosure and a slight misting female first thing and fed her 4th day and  introduced the males about 6:00am in the morning. Continued warming enclosure and misted  a couple times. One of the males was on her back at about 6:45 am and by 2:30pm they were coupled together . She wasn't happy he was on her back but she settled down after awhile. Iam also saving Young mature for remateing. Good luck.


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## Tonypace2009 (Mar 17, 2016)

Update my female ghost laid her second fertile ooth wensday afternoon. I will Remate my female Sunday with young male.


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## Kermit (Mar 17, 2016)

So cool to see you turn this around, both Tony and Sarah... I've found 8 weeks till hatch to be fairly reliable. You should start thinking about what you will need to do to prepare for the hatch... Specifically fruit flies and the enclosure. 

I keep the newly hatched in a 32 oz for about 2 weeks, then move them to a larger, fruit fly escape proof container. I use one of those large sourdough pretzel plastic barrels with a dense amount of artificial plants so the nymphs can have lots of surface area. Feed small fruit flies in 32oz hen move up to the Heidi's after 2 weeks. The new hatchlings should be given about 2 days before you start the ff. But be sure to mist with fine spray every 2-3 days. Not too much or nymphs can drown if it pools on the bottom of the container. 

Order ff about 2weeks before the anticipated hatch.

Look forward to your updates!


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## Tonypace2009 (Mar 17, 2016)

Already working on a fruit fly plan. The enclosure  I was looking at are the 80 oz cups with cloth lid they seem the easiest to set up very little modifying. But I am looking at a couple different options also. The pretzel barrels look supper cool but they are pricey for the pretzels. (All I need is the containers) I have been thinking about getting some of the 12 by 12 by 12 pop up net cubes for when they get bigger. I can hang them from my ceiling .one thing at a time.

My bug fund is getting low  looks like I may have to sale one or two of my tarantulas to build it back up.

Will keep you updated and will keep my eyes out for the dark one?


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## DeShawn (Mar 17, 2016)

Let me know when you need net cages.  I can sell them to you at cost (I get them wholesale) so long as you cover your shipping.


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## Tonypace2009 (Mar 18, 2016)

DeShawn said:


> Let me know when you need net cages.  I can sell them to you at cost (I get them wholesale) so long as you cover your shipping.


Thanks. I saw them on your site the other week and started thinking they would be perfect for housing for housing the ghost once they get L3 to L4 and up.


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## DeShawn (Mar 18, 2016)

Yea, they are retail price on the website.  Just send me a PM and I will get you a better rate.  They really are great for raising nymphs together.


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## Sarah K (Mar 18, 2016)

Hey Kermit,

I already have a batch of 32 ounce deli cups, which is where I am hoping to keep the ooths for hatching, as well as the newly hatched ghost nymphs. How many nymphs should we keep in each deli cup? And how long should I leave them in the deli cup in which they hatch, before trying to separate them into smaller batches?

Also, I keep regular fruit fly cultures going, so I am not worried about that either. So no fruit flies for 2 days, and a fine mist every 2 to 3 days? good to know! Thanks as always for letting us know exactly what we need! CONGRATS TONY!


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## Tonypace2009 (Mar 18, 2016)

Sarah K said:


> Hey Kermit,
> 
> I already have a batch of 32 ounce deli cups, which is where I am hoping to keep the ooths for hatching, as well as the newly hatched ghost nymphs. How many nymphs should we keep in each deli cup? And how long should I leave them in the deli cup in which they hatch, before trying to separate them into smaller batches?
> 
> Also, I keep regular fruit fly cultures going, so I am not worried about that either. So no fruit flies for 2 days, and a fine mist every 2 to 3 days? good to know! Thanks as always for letting us know exactly what we need! CONGRATS TONY!


I just asked DeShawn pretty much the same question. ( If keeping communally, you can keep 10-15 in a 32oz until L3, then usually better to move to a bigger enclosure.) Hope this helps


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## Sarah K (Mar 18, 2016)

Thanks Tony!


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## Kermit (Mar 18, 2016)

Sorry guys for the delayed response! This job thing keeps getting in the way of what I really want to do which is talk about praying mantis LOL!

I agree with DeSean. You will have some cannibalization but that is normal and infrequent as they are relatively communal species. I believe most incidents are accidental and happen when they are trying to feed on fruit flies. But it does happen.

After L3 males and females can pretty much be told apart. The biggest feature is the shape of the head crown. The female will be square-shaped and the male will look like a crooked hat. As they get a little bigger you will notice the male has more prominent antenne thicker and longer.

To prevent future cannibalism it is important that you separate them into male and female colonies after L3 or L4.

One of the nice features of the ghosts is that they can be kept in colonies so it is easier to feed them and that's where a larger enclosure comes into play.

32oz are great to hatch oothecas, and will work for the first couple of weeks.


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## Tonypace2009 (Mar 18, 2016)

Kermit said:


> Sorry guys for the delayed response! This job thing keeps getting in the way of what I really want to do which is talk about praying mantis LOL!
> 
> I agree with DeSean. You will have some cannibalization but that is normal and infrequent as they are relatively communal species. I believe most incidents are accidental and happen when they are trying to feed on fruit flies. But it does happen.
> 
> ...


 I plan on trying the pop up cubes when they reach L3 I am looking to get a couple at the beginning of April from DeShawn. How many nymph's male and female do you recommend keeping out of each ooth for future breeding. I was thinking 5  total from each ooth. (3 males and two females) or at least I am thinking of ending up with 6 females and 9 males total. Iam also trying to stager nymph's from each ooth so Iam sure to have ghost maturing within a week or so of each other. I know over thinking it but this is how my brain works.

Anyway separate male and females  at L3 or L4 gotcha thanks.


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## Kermit (Mar 19, 2016)

Tony... I suggest 6f, 9m like you said. I kept 5/5 and there were times I wondered if I should have kept more. Fluke things will always happen (as you've seen).

I did get 6 solid oothecas for my special "Vader" experiment! Ended up with 2 exceptional breeding momma's, and one stud of a male... It was close!

Next time I will keep a few more males.


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## Tonypace2009 (Mar 19, 2016)

Kermit said:


> Tony... I suggest 6f, 9m like you said. I kept 5/5 and there were times I wondered if I should have kept more. Fluke things will always happen (as you've seen).
> 
> I did get 6 solid oothecas for my special "Vader" experiment! Ended up with 2 exceptional breeding momma's, and one stud of a male... It was close!
> 
> Next time I will keep a few more males.


Cool thanks  I will keep an eye out for a dark one to send your way.

I went ahead and put the youngest mature  male in with female she is already fed up nicely and also released some moths in enclosure. So hopefully he will find her by tomorrow morning.


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## Sarah K (Mar 22, 2016)

Hey guys, I got some L2 ghost nymphs a few weeks ago, and now they are all L3. I would like to separate them into male  and female colonies, as you all suggested, but I am having such a hard time telling the difference in thier crowns. They all look kind of like crooked hats to me, and none of them look square! Can anyone post a picture of L3 ghost nymph male and female?


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## CosbyArt (Mar 22, 2016)

My Ghost photos don't have clear shots of their crowns at that age, and typically I don't bother to properly determine their sex as I don't breed them (pets only). I did find a couple of photos showing the difference, but they are both adults; however, the crown if correct should still be identifiable.

Here is one from the UK mantis forum, and from Andrew Mitchell on Flickr. See if that helps Sarah.


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## Tonypace2009 (Mar 22, 2016)

Sarah K said:


> Hey guys, I got some L2 ghost nymphs a few weeks ago, and now they are all L3. I would like to separate them into male  and female colonies, as you all suggested, but I am having such a hard time telling the difference in thier crowns. They all look kind of like crooked hats to me, and none of them look square! Can anyone post a picture of L3 ghost nymph male and female?


this may be L4 but look at the crown red arrow (this female) the notch on the males is deeper here and notch on top of crown is also deeper making it to appear to be a crooked hat.Also female has 6 segments underside of abdamon the male has more ( if I remember right 8 segments ) these are hard to count they dont stay still very long at this stage at least when you are looking at them. I dont have a clear picture of male .


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## Kermit (Mar 22, 2016)

Sarah would be easier if you send a few pics of your L3s and I will try to ID for you


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## Sarah K (Mar 23, 2016)

Thanks Tony! 

Kermit, we are heading out on a road trip tonight, but I am bringing the ghost nymphs with me, so I will get a picture in the next few days.


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## Sarah K (Mar 28, 2016)

Sorry for the delay, but I was having trouble posting pictures from my phone while I was away, and did not have access to a computer again until today. 

Here are two pictures of the same mantis, different angles:




 here are two of the same mantis, but different from the mantis above:


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## Sarah K (Mar 28, 2016)

Here are a few more:


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## LAME (Mar 28, 2016)

Looks like a female, based off the squared crown. The males have more jagged crowns.


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## Sarah K (Mar 28, 2016)

LAME said:


> Looks like a female, based off the squared crown. The males have more jagged crowns.


I have posted pictures of multiple mantises.....do you think every image here looks like a female?


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## DeShawn (Mar 28, 2016)

The pic before last is a male.  The rest are females.


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## Kermit (Mar 28, 2016)

This is a male

Crooked hat!


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## Kermit (Mar 28, 2016)

This is a female

More of aa square or block hat


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## LAME (Mar 29, 2016)

What they said, sorry I've been at work. I didn't even see that males photo Lol ^_^


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## Sarah K (Mar 29, 2016)

Thanks guys! So, it has more to do with the difference at the base of the crown, versus the top? As pictured below:

I guess I was just confused because the end of the crown on both genders seems to look the same, where it curves off to one side.


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