# HELP with fly pupae.



## Butterfly (Mar 6, 2009)

I just got 3 ghosts and some fly pupae, but dont know how to feed them to my babies.

Should they be flying around, and if so how do I get them to hatch? Theyre all just pupae, some bigger some smaller.

Im sure my babies are very hungry, theyve spent the last few days in transit getting to me.

Ive never used flies so this is all a bit new to me, any help is appreciated!!


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## Butterfly (Mar 6, 2009)

Ok I just bought some mealwors, and they wont take em.

Help, I dont want my new babies to starve and im in such a small town I cant get FF's without driving an hour and a half one way...

Even then I not sure I could find them.


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## hibiscusmile (Mar 6, 2009)

hey Butterfly, the babies are fat and sassy, won't go hungry! But to get them to take the mealworm, which they havent seen before  , cut them in half and let a little goo out and with tweezers or forcepts put it up under their mouth so they can taste it, they will grab it in a while. Also don't forget you guys can also feed your mantis the pupae, it wont hurt them and a lot of them eat it that way, also u could slice open the pupae and give them what is inside, and dont forget house spiders, makes a good meal!


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## Butterfly (Mar 6, 2009)

Butterfly said:


> Ok I just bought some mealwors, and they wont take em.Help, I dont want my new babies to starve and im in such a small town I cant get FF's without driving an hour and a half one way...
> 
> Even then I not sure I could find them.


Update:

Ok I squished a mealworms head and got one to take a whole one. And chopped another in half and got another baby to take it, the 3rd just ate a little and gave up.

But at least theyve eaten.

The Mystery mantis wont take anything yet, but hes so small im not sure what'll happen with him since I cant get ff's. Hopefully a fly will hatch soon for him.


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## hibiscusmile (Mar 6, 2009)

Well u just hit the nail on the head! Take a toothpick and some of the goo from the mealworm and place it to its mouth, it will eat just like the others, if it is to small, try to touch its mouth and lower the toothpick right below it and leave it there, mine will usually follow it down or go down to see if it is there.


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## Rick (Mar 6, 2009)

Are the flies pupated or are they maggots? If they are pupae you can just put them in a 32 oz deli cup and wait for them to hatch. When they do feed them honey and put the whole container in the freezer for a few minutes to slow them down. Then pick them out with tweezers and put them in with the mantids. Thats what I do. As for mealworms, well they are not a good mantis food.


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## Butterfly (Mar 6, 2009)

OK last Question about these guys. lol I think!

Do I need to keep the mealwors or the pupae in the fridge or just on a counter?


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## OGIGA (Mar 6, 2009)

Butterfly said:


> OK last Question about these guys. lol I think!Do I need to keep the mealwors or the pupae in the fridge or just on a counter?


Meal worms can go in the refrigerator if desired. I recommend against refrigerating the pupae for more than a couple weeks because they'll just not hatch/eclose in there and eventually will die.


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## hibiscusmile (Mar 6, 2009)

yea like O said, but always keep out enough to hatch for each days feeding, I can keep pupae about 2 weeks in fridge.


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## Rick (Mar 7, 2009)

It is best to get maggots instead of pupae. They will keep for weeks in the fridge. You then take some out and let them pupate and hatch. Keep mealworms out of the fridge or get rid of them all together which is what I would do.


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## robelgado (Mar 7, 2009)

Like Rebecca said, use house spiders, mantids absolutely love those things. they eat the legs and all.


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## PhilinYuma (Mar 8, 2009)

O.K. Everyone's in church, I guess, or recovering from Saturday night, so I'll make my own post.

Many members have been concerned about how long house fly pupae can survive in the refrigerator (about two weeks if it's not too cold (36+) and overlook the fact that adults can be maintained for between four and six weeks under the right conditions (temps around 70-80F, adequate food and humidity).

I think that Katt has posted this useful URL before: http://www.adcham.com/html/insects/insects-fly-rearing.html

I have used it to raise houseflies and found that to be a messy and uncertain business, so now I maintain two buckets of flies with eclosure dates two weeks apart and order from SpiderPharm once a month.

A few notes on the setup on the AdCham website.

The only procedure that requires anything remotely approaching skill is cutting a hole in the bucket to take the nominal 4" PVC or ABS pipe, which must take a slightly deformed 8oz deli cup (take one to the store to check, if you are unsure). Cut out a paper template of the outer circumference of the pipe and stick it on the bucket about 4" from the bottom. Cut out the hole with a utility or Exacto knife. You will find that because of the curvature of the bucket, the pipe will fit from top to bottom but not side to side. Carefully expand the side of the hole until the pipe fits, the tighter the fit the better. Glue the pipe in place with with plenty of epoxy cement and let it cure for 24 hours. You could try an appropriate sized hole saw on a drill, but you'd have to be sure that it was the right size.

Place an 8oz cup filled with water and wood chips in the bucket, opposite the port opening Place a large pair of pantyhose (queen size"?) over the top of the bucket so that the legs are centered and outside the bucket.

Differences from the website:

You can get 6" precut pipe. That is long enough.

Cover the outside of the port with the sleeve of a black, heavy sweater (Goodwill) and be sure that it fits securely, and cement in place. Nearly done. Cut the foot off one of the panty hose legs, high enough so that you can fit an inverted 32oz cup into it. This will sit upside down on top of the bucket.

Place one 80z pot containing whatever you like to feed your flies and another containing the fly pupae (the water container is already in place) and wait. You will find that the heavy black sleeve on the port doesn't need to be secured, since the flies will not fly into the dark.

In a couple of days, you will find that the flies have emerged and all you have to do is top um the food and maintain the humidity (I introduce a vial of water through the port and top up the level in the pot) and food, and harvest a day's supply of flies.

With a little encouragement, the flies will enter the cup. Reach in through the port with a lid and close the cup. Twist off the stocking below the lid and secure it with locking forceps (Radio Shack) or a wire twist. Remove the pot, add another and release the clamp. Prepare the flies for feeding in whatever what you prefer, by chilling or capturing in individual vials, or hypnotizing them to fly into the mantis enclosures.

The advantages of this method are long life of flies from one batch of pupae, no uncertainty, ease of maintenance and relatively low escape rate.

Good luck!


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## nasty bugger (Mar 11, 2009)

As much space as was between the body of Phil's post and the end I was hoping that a photo of the apparatus would be shown, but no such luck.

What about a photo of this contraption Phil? or a link


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## Rick (Mar 12, 2009)

PhilinYuma said:


> O.K. Everyone's in church, I guess, or recovering from Saturday night, so I'll make my own post. Many members have been concerned about how long house fly pupae can survive in the refrigerator (about two weeks if it's not too cold (36+) and overlook the fact that adults can be maintained for between four and six weeks under the right conditions (temps around 70-80F, adequate food and humidity).
> 
> I think that Katt has posted this useful URL before: http://www.adcham.com/html/insects/insects-fly-rearing.html
> 
> ...


Ya know I really don't understand why so many members here use some of these complicated methods for feeders when there are far easier ways to do these things. &lt;_&lt;


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## PhilinYuma (Mar 12, 2009)

Rick said:


> Ya know I really don't understand why so many members here use some of these complicated methods for feeders when there are far easier ways to do these things. &lt;_&lt;


Gotta agree with you Rick!  All that messing around with refrigerating pupae and maggots and hoping that your Significant Other doesn't complain, losing a lot of the pupae because they have been refrigerated at too low a temperature and having to take them out every so often and leave them at room temp for four hours (or so says Chuck, who should know), tossing a few in an enclosure and hoping that they'll eclose, the list goes on. And don't forget all those escapees!

My system cost under $2 for the tights and the pipe (a few bucks more if you have to buy epoxy, and everyone has, or can get free, a 5 gallon bucket), took less than twenty minutes to build, and requires about a minute or two a day for harvesting adding water and, once a week, for feeding, plus an extra minute to stun the flies in the freezer each day.

Best of all, I have a good idea of how many flies I have available at any given time, and they last over twice as long as they would in the fridge, so long as I maintain the humidity and keep the temp around 80F.

Oh, and I have close to no escapees!

So far, I have spent more time writing up the instructions and answering helpful comments than I have with the setup (I'm a lousy typist!). :lol: 

Has anyone else contemplated using this setup? Go for it!


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## nasty bugger (Mar 12, 2009)

My flies I got from chuck lasted about a month, maybe a bit more, in the fridge. I kept them in the door, where it's a bit warmer, if you call that warm. That is where I was told to keep my mealworms also.

Some of the last flies didn't hatch out, but I had so many, chuck gave a bag of the pupae still in the shaving/food stuff, so I had a bunch to deal with and some loss wasn't too bad considering I only had twenty or thirty mantis' at the time.

I would be interested in viewing your fly keeper Phil.

The way I did it was keep the bag in the fridge and put a layer of pupae in a 32 oz deli cup to warm them outside the fridge. The lid of the cup has a hole in it the size of the little tubes that hold the FF's from petsmart.

I plug the hole in the deli cup with the sponge from the petsmart tube, and when I needed flies I'd remove the sponge plug and insert the open end of the cleaned out FF tube. After some flies entered the tube I'd pull it off and plug it with a toilet p paper plug and reinsert the sponge in the deli lid.

Sometimes I'd flip the tube over and put the closed end in the deli lid while plugging the tube, then pull the tube out or the deli lid and plug with the sponge.

Tube goes into freezer for 2 minutes, then I just tap two to four flies from the tube into my hand and toss em into each individual mantis jar.

Sometimes I'd just put some pupae right into the jars. I like the other method though cause I can actually see what the mantis is getting.

I didn't want the flies in my apt, but I have a storage area that is 6 times bigger than what I had before, so I have a place to keep them outside now, and it's gonna be 88 degrees next week, whew....................


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## Rick (Mar 12, 2009)

PhilinYuma said:


> Gotta agree with you Rick!  All that messing around with refrigerating pupae and maggots and hoping that your Significant Other doesn't complain, losing a lot of the pupae because they have been refrigerated at too low a temperature and having to take them out every so often and leave them at room temp for four hours (or so says Chuck, who should know), tossing a few in an enclosure and hoping that they'll eclose, the list goes on. And don't forget all those escapees!My system cost under $2 for the tights and the pipe (a few bucks more if you have to buy epoxy, and everyone has, or can get free, a 5 gallon bucket), took less than twenty minutes to build, and requires about a minute or two a day for harvesting adding water and, once a week, for feeding, plus an extra minute to stun the flies in the freezer each day.
> 
> Best of all, I have a good idea of how many flies I have available at any given time, and they last over twice as long as they would in the fridge, so long as I maintain the humidity and keep the temp around 80F.
> 
> ...


I wasn't bashing your technique and while it may not take much time for you it is much more than what is needed.

Maybe pupae are more work than the maggots which is what I get. I toss them in the drawer at the bottom of the fridge and only time I touch them is when I take some out. I get a 32 oz deli cup and put some maggots into it. I set that on the shelf and when they are flies I can stick that whole thing in the freezer for a few minutes. Then I take my long tweezers and pluck out the flies and put them into the mantids cages. That takes a couple minutes at most. By the time the flies warm up I am done. No escapes.

When I use half the flies I take another batch of maggots from the fridge and let them turn into flies. This way I always have a constant supply of flies. You're talking about wood chips, pvc, epoxy, pantyhose, etc.......WOW. My way seems soooo much easier and the only materials needed is a 32 oz deli cup and a lid. Seems too many members here hear of somebody doing things a certain way and try to copy that technique when there are easier ways it can be done. I guess I think for myself.


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## PhilinYuma (Mar 12, 2009)

Rick said:


> I wasn't bashing your technique and while it may not take much time for you it is much more than what is needed. When I use half the flies I take another batch of maggots from the fridge and let them turn into flies. This way I always have a constant supply of flies. You're talking about wood chips, pvc, epoxy, pantyhose, etc.......WOW. My way seems soooo much easier and the only materials needed is a 32 oz deli cup and a lid. Seems too many members here hear of somebody doing things a certain way and try to copy that technique when there are easier ways it can be done. I guess I think for myself.


And I'm certainly not bashing yours, Rick. I think that this is often an issue of time and inclination, though, rather than philosophy. I imagine that you have a full time job and a family and like to watch some TV in the evenings. I am retired, live alone and don't watch TV any more so I have the time and energy for projects that you may not. I actually enjoyed setting up the bucket and seeing how well it worked and was really looking for a guaranteed and adequate supply of flies on any given day rather than saving time. I doubt if anyone else will use this system, particularly not those who are not very handy, but the idea is out there for anyone who is interested.

Thinking for yourself is fine, but the whole idea of a forum like this is to share ideas. I started using Carolina's formula 4-24 on your recommendation, not to save time, but to get consistent, mold free results and because it is cost effective.

And now I have to finish washing used ff medium pots (though it would be easier to chuck 'em and use new ones), and go and catch some bees before it gets too late (though it would be easier to just use crix).


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## Rick (Mar 13, 2009)

PhilinYuma said:


> And I'm certainly not bashing yours, Rick. I think that this is often an issue of time and inclination, though, rather than philosophy. I imagine that you have a full time job and a family and like to watch some TV in the evenings. I am retired, live alone and don't watch TV any more so I have the time and energy for projects that you may not. I actually enjoyed setting up the bucket and seeing how well it worked and was really looking for a guaranteed and adequate supply of flies on any given day rather than saving time. I doubt if anyone else will use this system, particularly not those who are not very handy, but the idea is out there for anyone who is interested. Thinking for yourself is fine, but the whole idea of a forum like this is to share ideas. I started using Carolina's formula 4-24 on your recommendation, not to save time, but to get consistent, mold free results and because it is cost effective.
> 
> And now I have to finish washing used ff medium pots (though it would be easier to chuck 'em and use new ones), and go and catch some bees before it gets too late (though it would be easier to just use crix).


Actually I am laid off right now so I have plenty of time though I don't have a single mantis right now. Even with unlimited time I stick to the easiest and fastest methods.


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## hibiscusmile (Mar 13, 2009)

:lol: So once again I show up late! That's cause I have to chase flies........................come back here you fuzzy black devil! ha ha gotcha ! opps, smached...hahahaha..... I thought I would never do maggots, but guess what! The no worms girl is now up to her elbows with magi's! I actually like them. Like Rick says just pop them out and they pupae and turn to flies, it is just hard right now timing them, any tips Rick? I know u told me , but I forget.... I love to do the setups like Phil does, but with time flying by so fast, I have settled to buy, seperate, fridge, set out, eat!


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## Rick (Mar 14, 2009)

hibiscusmile said:


> :lol: So once again I show up late! That's cause I have to chase flies........................come back here you fuzzy black devil! ha ha gotcha ! opps, smached...hahahaha..... I thought I would never do maggots, but guess what! The no worms girl is now up to her elbows with magi's! I actually like them. Like Rick says just pop them out and they pupae and turn to flies, it is just hard right now timing them, any tips Rick? I know u told me , but I forget.... I love to do the setups like Phil does, but with time flying by so fast, I have settled to buy, seperate, fridge, set out, eat!


They take about a week for me to go from maggot to fly. You have to time it to know when to start a new batch that will turn into flies before you run out of the others. Figure out how long they take in your place and go from there.


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## hibiscusmile (Mar 14, 2009)

Thanks Rick, they are taking about 8 days from magi to fly!


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## bassist (Mar 15, 2009)

Since this is about flies and I'd rather not start a new thread I can get a free source of maggots people in the apartments here don't throw out their trash till it's maggot infested (honestly disgusting when you see it lmao) would raising those to flies be a good idea?


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## Rick (Mar 15, 2009)

bassist said:


> Since this is about flies and I'd rather not start a new thread I can get a free source of maggots people in the apartments here don't throw out their trash till it's maggot infested (honestly disgusting when you see it lmao) would raising those to flies be a good idea?


If you want too. Might save some money. Won't hurt anything. I wouldn't but that's just me.


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## hibiscusmile (Mar 15, 2009)

I would, it shouldnt hurt anything, use them, they just gonna turn into flies and you will end up swatting them anyways


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## PhilinYuma (Mar 15, 2009)

bassist said:


> Since this is about flies and I'd rather not start a new thread I can get a free source of maggots people in the apartments here don't throw out their trash till it's maggot infested (honestly disgusting when you see it lmao) would raising those to flies be a good idea?


Well, you have two thumbs up from two experienced maggot people, so let me be sure what's involved.

You are going to pull bags of "disgusting" fly blown garbage out of the trash and sort the maggots from the used diapers, etc.?

Then are you going to keep them in a box outside or put them in your refrigerator like Rick and Hibiscusmile do?

Do you live alone? Does anyone ever visit you? Will you be eating the food out of the refrigerator if you will be keeping the maggots in it?

Have you checked the price of fly pupae on the SpiderPharm site?

Please tell us your plan!


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