2009 I. oratoria incubation info

[kamakiri]

First of all, thanks to joossa for a pair of oratoria ooths!

This is the info for the smaller of the two:

Ooth laid: 11/5/08

In cold storage between joossa and I from 12/1/08 through 1/19/09. While it was with me, it was in the garage in the evenings and in the fridge during the day. All to simulate a slightly cooler climate.

Incubation start 1/19/09 near lamp ~12". 80 to 90 deg F daytime. 68 to 71 deg. F at night.

Hatching start: 3/9/09

Day 1 hatch: 6

Day 2 hatch: 23

Day 3 hatch: 7

Day 4 hatch: 3

Day 5 hatch: 1

There is still about 1/4 of the ooth that has not hatched. The hatch progressed from one side, which was closer to the lamp. It happens to be the terminal end as it was laid.

And boy, these guys are tiny! :lol: I'm a little surprised they could take melanos on day 2 after hatching.

 

[MantidLord]

First of all, thanks to joossa for a pair of oratoria ooths! This is the info for the smaller of the two:

Ooth laid: 11/5/08

In cold storage between joossa and I from 12/1/08 through 1/19/09. While it was with me, it was in the garage in the evenings and in the fridge during the day. All to simulate a slightly cooler climate.

Incubation start 1/19/09 near lamp ~12". 80 to 90 deg F daytime. 68 to 71 deg. F at night.

Hatching start: 3/9/09

Day 1 hatch: 6

Day 2 hatch: 23

Day 3 hatch: 7

Day 4 hatch: 3

Day 5 hatch: 1

There is still about 1/4 of the ooth that has not hatched. The hatch progressed from one side, which was closer to the lamp. It happens to be the terminal end as it was laid.

And boy, these guys are tiny! :lol: I'm a little surprised they could take melanos on day 2 after hatching.

You fed them melanogaster!? I didn't think they could take them. I feed my hydei up until L4.

 

[kamakiri]

You fed them melanogaster!? I didn't think they could take them. I feed my hydei up until L4.

:huh: I'm confoosed? Just hatched, I think they're lighter than the hydei!?

 

[MantidLord]

No, they'll take the larger hydei as well. It's better because the two hydei should satisfy them until L2. Though for some it may be harder to catch (survival of the fittest). And besides, they look like kids with giant cotton candy when they eat them.

 

[Katnapper]

You fed them melanogaster!? I didn't think they could take them. I feed my hydei up until L4.

MantidLord, I'm a bit confused too. If the nymphs are tiny, wouldn't feeding them D. melanogaster be more appropriate than the larger D. hydei? If giving D. melanogaster is in question because of the size, feeding D. hydei would be going in the opposite direction... absurd, no? :huh:

 

[MantidLord]

I'm sorry, I know where I confused you guys. What I meant to say is that although the nymphs are so small, they are capable of taking the larger hydei, which for me, is more efficient because it means less fruitflies spent until they grow. I realize they'd take melanogaster, it's just why would "you" feed them a bunch of melanogaster when you can feed them maybe two hydei? And no, I didn't mean to question any of your methods or melanogaster in size. Sorry for the confusion.lol.

 

[kamakiri]

No problem, MantidLord...I also generally believe in feeding the largest food that a nymph will take. I try to feed hydei whenever I can. But I tried a few with the remaining L1s and as far as I can see there were no takers. But these were large ones from the start of a culture production. I could see them taking ones that are just a bit smaller.

 

[MantidLord]

Nice pics. I allways forget how small they are until they hatch. At what instar do you plan on separating them? I have noticed that unless the L1s are on a branch, they can't control the ffs. I watched as one mantis was tossed left and right when he/she caught a ff on the ground. Had to let go because it couldn't get a grip. By "remaining" I guess you have L2s now, this is by far the most boring stage for me. :lol: They don't seem to be as active as the other instars <_< , maybe it's just me. Keep us updated please.

 

[kamakiri]

Yeah, almost all L2s as of last night...

Not sure when I'm going to separate 'em. I still have about 35...since I think there were some predation casualties during L2 molting, I was thinking somewhere closer to 20 so I don't end up with too many.

 

[kamakiri]

My second ooth just started hatching yesterday!

Incubation time was much shorter for this one. It was pulled out of cold storage on 3/15 and started hatching yesterday with 5 nymphs.

There are 30 nymphs from the first ooth left and they just started molting to L5.

 

[MantidLord]

My second ooth just started hatching yesterday! Incubation time was much shorter for this one. It was pulled out of cold storage on 3/15 and started hatching yesterday with 5 nymphs.

There are 30 nymphs from the first ooth left and they just started molting to L5.

Man, none of mine have hatched yet, and they've been incubating for a month now. Starting to loose patience. :angry:

 

[kamakiri]

Man, none of mine have hatched yet, and they've been incubating for a month now. Starting to loose patience. :angry:

Well my first one took two months, and the second was a month and a half under slightly higher temps. If you want them to hatch as soon as possible, I suggest trying to get them to 90-95 degrees F, and bringing them in if you have to. If you leave them outside at 70-80F, I think you might be waiting at least another month.

One more thing to note about the second ooth: I rotated it once in a while relative to the halogen lamp and unlike the first ooth which started hatching from the side nearest the lamp, this one seems a little random since there's hatching from both ends. So I think heat is the main factor in reducing hatching time.

The second one hatched 5 on the first day and 8 on the second. Of course, nothing yet today since I'm home

 

[MantidLord]

Thanks Kamakiri. I'll definately take that into consideration. I guess I'm a little impatient because I had ooths that hatched a month after being layed in room temperature with no dispause. And these ooths are the ones that didn't hatch during that odd period. So I'll crank up the heat.

 

[MantidLord]

Okay, so this evening when I was walking home from school, I saw a hatched ooth, and whent up to it so find nymphs scurring around! I was only able to capture three, but that's three more than what I had before. I'm still waiting for my own ooths to hatch... <_<

 

[MantidLord]

As of now, I have 30-40 nymphs running around. all wild caught from various ooths I caught hatching outside. None of them are "mine" but I'm not complaining.

 

[kamakiri]

As of now, I have 30-40 nymphs running around. all wild caught from various ooths I caught hatching outside. None of them are "mine" but I'm not complaining.

Yeah, that's not a bad way to get them! :lol:

Surprisingly, my second and larger ooth has only hatched 13 nymphs. I wonder if keeping them in the fridge a couple of months longer reduced the hatch rate...

 

[MantidLord]

Yeah, that's not a bad way to get them! :lol: Surprisingly, my second and larger ooth has only hatched 13 nymphs. I wonder if keeping them in the fridge a couple of months longer reduced the hatch rate...

Well what about putting them outside for a natural cold period? I mean, if they are naturally found in the area wouldn't putting the ooths in the fridge risk drying out some eggs?

 

[kamakiri]

Well what about putting them outside for a natural cold period? I mean, if they are naturally found in the area wouldn't putting the ooths in the fridge risk drying out some eggs?

Yes, according to the directions I got from joossa. I probably didn't add water often enough.

 

[MantidLord]

Oh, that probably could explain my ooths if they don't hatch. Hey, at what point did your nymphs start cannibalising? I know they start at L1, but after how many days do they start feasting on each other. So far they're eating aphids and small beetles, but they'll only smack at each other or crowd together. I'm just trying to anticipate the cannibalism so I can add more food and because I'm curious.