Southeast Arizona Mantis- ID Please

[Jay]

Apologies ahead of time for the large pictures- I don't know how to make them much smaller. Here are a couple of pics of a type of mantis from Southeast Arizona. Of the hundred or so oothecas I found only a handful were viable because of already having been hatched or because of attacks from parasitic wasps.

Here is a picture of the oothecas that I found. One of the lighter oothecas hatched out a mantis that was a little bit lighter and longer than the dark oothecas hatched out. All mantids that hatched out had the front of their forearms much shorter than the back of their forearms.

I also found a female mantis in the same area. When I found her she was a tan color. With enough humidity and several moults she is now green. She is slender, is skilled at freezing into position, and her legs are rather long. Like the nymphs, the front of her forearm is rather short. I am guessing she is a Stagmomantis gracilipes. What do you think?

Edit: I must add that the oothecas are very hard to the touch, and although they look like European oothecas they are definitely not- having seen hundreds of European oothecas they do not have the "soft" feel to them.

 

[robo mantis]

i'd say california mantis and some of the top ooth look like European mantids.

 

[Rick]

Ooths appear to be stagmomantis.

 

[OGIGA]

The dark ooths look a lot like ooths from stagmomantis californica. However, I'm not saying that the ooths you gathered are from stagmomantis californica.

 

[Jay]

I'm glad that we have narrowed it down to stagmomantis. Here is some additional information:

All hatchlings are thin and elegant looking, much like the picture of the female. One of the lighter oothecas hatched a couple mantises. They are larger, have dark backs and are brown on the rest of their bodies while the dark oothecas hatch out smaller mantises that are green and brown. All oothecas do not hatch out all at once but hatch out over the course of a week or so.

 

[Rick]

That may be a male. It's not adult however I cannot really see the segments to verify.

 

[Jay]

I'm pretty sure I counted six segments on the underside. I will double check though.

 

[dannyboy]

tis pretty hard to tell but in my opinion i would say it was a female only time can tell tho\s

 

[Rick]

tis pretty hard to tell but in my opinion i would say it was a female only time can tell tho\s

It's easy to tell. Just not from the pic.

 

[yen_saw]

My guess is sub-subadult male, the bright yellow color on the edge of budwing also makes it looks like Stagmomantis Limbata. The oothecae collected are of Stagmomantis sp.

 

[Jay]

I definitely counted six segments on the underside. The right way to count the segments is on the underside, right? Do males of Stagmomantises have six segments on the abdomen? Also- the last segment on the underside is rather long. Can males have long end segments?

The closest thing I have seen to what I have is on this webpage: http://bugsincyberspace.com/stagmomantis_gracilipes.html

Although the larger nymph I have is now green, it was quite tan when I found it, as mentioned earlier. If I feed this mantis a lot he/she does not get bulkier, but rather he/she just ends up molting.

 

[yen_saw]

Sorry i wanted to say sub-subadult female, but no idea how i end-up putting male instead. I see 6 segments from the pic. It does look like Stagmomantis Gracilipes from Peter's website as female limbata should have wider abdomen.

 

[dannyboy]

yeh yeh thts what i thought but i counted six segments aswell