Chinese Sexing

[Norlin]

Here are three L4 Chinese, looking to try to determine their sex and see if I understand this segment counting thing.

1: I count 8 segments, so my guess is male.

2ne segment slightly hidden behind the leg, I count 8 (or maybe 9 if that last dot at the end is a segment?) so guess male again

3: again 8 or 9 (thought 8 was the max) so male? It was hard to see the segments at all on this one due to the coloration, camera caught them better than my eyes could.

so is it a bunch of males or is L4 too early for the segments to fuse in a female?

 

[agent A]

If u look at the end of the abdomen, males have an almost flat diamond shape from below

Females have a pointed shape that curves downward...

 

[psyconiko]

The first 2 pictures look like females...The third one looks like a male.Do not punish me if I am wrong! :cowboy:

 

[Ntsees]

Appears to be all males.

 

[Rick]

All males there. Easy to tell on those pics. Females will have exactly six segments and the last segment will be large. Last segment on males is small.

 

[eyes]

After having just gone through this I wouldn't rely on counting the segments, use agent A's method as it's much more reliable. Although I'm not sure how easy it is to do on nymphs. Regardless, in my case the segment count was always unreliable no matter their age.

 

[eyes]

See here (also note wing size on Chinese is the same for male or female):

Male:

Female:

 

[happy1892]

After having just gone through this I wouldn't rely on counting the segments, use agent A's method as it's much more reliable. Although I'm not sure how easy it is to do on nymphs. Regardless, in my case the segment count was always unreliable no matter their age.

When they are old enough it is the most reliable thing I think. Maybe Chinese Mantids like Deroplatys lobata do not change the amount of segments at L3 and the females keep 8 segments for at least to L4 but this is not many of them so they could easily be all male I guess. I do not know if in the females at L3 6 segments can be seen while 8 on the males. My Sphodromantis sp. "Blue Flash" and Stagmomantis carolina could be sexed by counting segments starting at L3 and not at L1 or L2 because they all had 8 segments and I watched them become adult so I know I sexed them right.

 

[Norlin]

hrm, awesome feedback, ok how about this, I don't understand how to get a good butt shot, but here's an attempt. Same three mantids in the same order:

1:

2:

3:

 

[agent A]

First 2 look like females last looks male

 

[happy1892]

Wait a minute! I sexed my Chinese Mantids when they were L3 or L4 by counting the segments! I guess all the ones that have 8 segments are males.

 

[Rick]

After having just gone through this I wouldn't rely on counting the segments, use agent A's method as it's much more reliable. Although I'm not sure how easy it is to do on nymphs. Regardless, in my case the segment count was always unreliable no matter their age.

Then you are doing it wrong. Counting segments is the best way for nymphs. What agentA is saying is not reliable for nymphs and is even harder to tell unless the nymphs are late instars.

I have a thread on this:

http://mantidforum.n...?showtopic=7110

First 2 look like females last looks male

How do you figure? I can clearly count more than six segments on those two. Stop trying to reinvent the wheel and look at the number of segments.

 

[happy1892]

How do you figure? I can clearly count more than six segments on those two. Stop trying to reinvent the wheel and look at the number of segments.

Yes, Chinese Mantids can be sexed by counting the segments, at least from L4 and probably from L3. So I think those are males.

 

[agent A]

Then you are doing it wrong. Counting segments is the best way for nymphs. What agentA is saying is not reliable for nymphs and is even harder to tell unless the nymphs are late instars.

I have a thread on this:

http://mantidforum.n...?showtopic=7110

How do you figure? I can clearly count more than six segments on those two. Stop trying to reinvent the wheel and look at the number of segments.

It's the way I sex the nymphs, a magnifying glass helps

I have trouble counting segments cause the moment the nymph moves I lose track

 

[angelofdeathzz]

Chinese having very large abdomens make's counting much easier than with most species, I agree with Rick and all 3 are male for sure!

 

[agent A]

Chinese having very large abdomens make's counting much easier than with most species, I agree with Rick and all 3 are male for sure!

But what about L3/L4 creos? They r a pain in the butt to sex but look at the abdomen from the sides and the fēmåłé has an obvious bulging ovipositor...

 

[Rick]

You can count segments on all species. Some have other clues as well which work better. These are all male.

 

[ismart]

All three definitely males. Hope you have some females?

 

[Norlin]

I'm sure one of the other 37 is female...or at least I hope so