Experience with Afican dealer

[hibiscusmile]

Also the same site offers this advice on African dealers and others:

http://www.terraristik.com/sticklist/changes_2005.html

 

[dafke14]

Also the same site offers this advice on African dealers and others:http://www.terraristik.com/sticklist/changes_2005.html

Thats the site where i found this dealer Oresh sairo

 

[Fisherman_Brazil]

Thanks for all the information and advices. There is nothing wrong to trust people, just have to be careful that not everyone being trustworthy. And sadly, I am not really good at this!

The dealer is still writing to me every few days. I really don't know how to response. Maybe just keep silent. What would you suggest? my friends.

 

[tier]

It does not depend on how you act. He will fool you if he wants to fool you. No matter what you do. This problem is well known since some years.

Be happy you got some Parasphendale, this is better than some other cases.

PS: How should an african collector (please dont try to tell me he is a breeder) know anything about the taxonomy? If you not send him a picture of Hemiempusa, how should he know?

Be happy with the Sphodromantis and Parasphendale even its not Idolomantis and Hemiempusa

PS: You should start to wonder if an african "seller" offers you all species you want, even southamerican and south asian ones.

Regards

 

[tier]

Hi

What I forgot:

How should an african collector should know that the ooth he is collecting is already 3 years old and in fact empty?

These people are no breeders! Always remember.

PS:

Soon there will be no more Idolomantis ooth in the wild thanks to makeing a quick dollar.

BUY FROM BREEDERS!

 

[dafke14]

I would advice to send just enough to send youre order and for the dealers expences to collect about 50 euro.

Then if you receive it you send the rest of the money he wants.

 

[Christian]

You can tell the people as often as you want to avoid deals with African collectors; noone listens, everyone knows it better.

Please don't get me wrong, but maybe this was as lesson you had to learn. The next time you will not send any money in advance to any collector of wildcaught specimens. You spent about 650 dollars (if I got it right) in hope to get Idolomantis. It would have been much cheaper and safer if you had bought from a breeder. I admit that there aren't many, but this species is available occasionally. The only reason I can imagine why people constantly try to import ooths is that they want to sell most of the hatchlings for a lot of money. Please excuse if I can't really take pity on you (and all the others) in this case. Wild-caught specimens should be, if necessary at all, just for you and not another way of overexploiting nature. You can still sell your own F1-x generations if you should breed the species successfully.

By the way, if you don't know what Hemiempusa looks like, how do you want to explain it to a collector?

 

[PhilinYuma]

Thanks for all the information and advices. There is nothing wrong to trust people, just have to be careful that not everyone being trustworthy. And sadly, I am not really good at this!The dealer is still writing to me every few days. I really don't know how to response. Maybe just keep silent. What would you suggest? my friends.

Poor Luke! This is about the only part of your sad story that I can help you with. I suggest a one word reply, and you can choose what you think is the most apropriate language from this short list:

Zulu: Amasimba!

Russian: чёрт!

German: Scheiße!

French: Merde!

Spanish: Mierda!

Thai: Kee! (Oops! Nearly forgot that one!)

Mantid Forum English: ######!

I hope that this helps.

 

[dafke14]

You can tell the people as often as you want to avoid deals with African collectors; noone listens, everyone knows it better.Please don't get me wrong, but maybe this was as lesson you had to learn. The next time you will not send any money in advance to any collector of wildcaught specimens. You spent about 650 dollars (if I got it right) in hope to get Idolomantis. It would have been much cheaper and safer if you had bought from a breeder. I admit that there aren't many, but this species is available occasionally. The only reason I can imagine why people constantly try to import ooths is that they want to sell most of the hatchlings for a lot of money. Please excuse if I can't really take pity on you (and all the others) in this case. Wild-caught specimens should be, if necessary at all, just for you and not another way of overexploiting nature. You can still sell your own F1-x generations if you should breed the species successfully.

By the way, if you don't know what Hemiempusa looks like, how do you want to explain it to a collector?

I am verry sorry but you are wrong with this one

My case i can deffend and Luke probably also.

When i have contacted this Oresh Sairo for idolo ooths i only have ordered 3 in order to have at least one hatch as sometimes there are wasps and stuff in it and dont hatch.

He then would reply:

Hi Dave,

minimua order should be 15 pcs of Idolomantis diabolica and other assorted ooths like 9december,brown and green ooths.

Payment can be done through western union money transfer.

So now you can place your carrent order.

The minimum order is 15 for oths because i travel a hundres of miles fo collection so it is not easy to go for 3 pcs only.

hope to hear from you again

best regards

Oresh

You see that not everybody wants to gain big bucks with them as you may think, and i know that Luke is not in for the money just obsessed for this species like most of us do.

Best regards Dave

 

[Christian]

Of course he wants to sell you 15 instead of 3. If he can fraud you with 3 ooths, why not with 15? Obviously there are enough people out there to steal money from.

The point is a different one: to obtain a good amount for oneself, say

to have at least one hatch

it is sufficient to order from a breeder. Not only will you save "some" bucks, but you will also get an established stock which performs better under captive conditions. So far, only very few stocks arose from imported ooths. Most vanished already in the first generation due to unknown requirements (as the different stocks seem to differ from each other) or inexperienced breeding skills. This, again, has also been said several times.

 

[PhilinYuma]

Of course he wants to sell you 15 instead of 3. If he can fraud you with 3 ooths, why not with 15? Obviously there are enough people out there to steal money from.The point is a different one: to obtain a good amount for oneself, say it is sufficient to order from a breeder. Not only will you save "some" bucks, but you will also get an established stock which performs better under captive conditions. So far, only very few stocks arose from imported ooths. Most vanished already in the first generation due to unknown requirements (as the different stocks seem to differ from each other) or inexperienced breeding skills. This, again, has also been said several times.

I think, perhaps, Christian, that you are missing Dafke's point. He is taking exception to your statement, "The only reason I can imagine why people constantly try to import ooths is that they want to sell most of the hatchlings for a lot of money."

It seems evident, to me at least, from Luke's posts on this forum, particularly in the "mantids for sale/trade" section that that he has no such intention.

 

[Fisherman_Brazil]

You can tell the people as often as you want to avoid deals with African collectors; noone listens, everyone knows it better.Please don't get me wrong, but maybe this was as lesson you had to learn. The next time you will not send any money in advance to any collector of wildcaught specimens. You spent about 650 dollars (if I got it right) in hope to get Idolomantis. It would have been much cheaper and safer if you had bought from a breeder. I admit that there aren't many, but this species is available occasionally. The only reason I can imagine why people constantly try to import ooths is that they want to sell most of the hatchlings for a lot of money. Please excuse if I can't really take pity on you (and all the others) in this case. Wild-caught specimens should be, if necessary at all, just for you and not another way of overexploiting nature. You can still sell your own F1-x generations if you should breed the species successfully.

By the way, if you don't know what Hemiempusa looks like, how do you want to explain it to a collector?

I rather like to beleive Christian did not mean to hurt people as the English being not his mother language.

The fact are:

1. I ordered from Swiss at UD$400 ea, 320 Euro for a couple of from German, and 100 Euro from Poland; the first one did not sent to me because of busy working schedule and returning my check, the second did NOT reach me at all, but returned by the custom to the breeder and then hear no more news ever since; the third one never hatched. All of those people has name.

2. I ordered from African breeder because of my another German friend, who I trust.

3. I did not order anything other than Idolomantis, they send them without my prove/agree, then tlod me that is the Hemiempusa.

 

[Christian]

I see, obviously you weren't really lucky with obtaining them. However, the ooths from Poland were also imported ones (he sold them over here as well), and most of those don't hatch. The price for pairs from Germany and Switzerland were rather high. I can't tell you more without knowing the source. Please write me a PM.