giving honey

[massaman]

ok tried to give a little honey to my female chinese mantis and not sure if this is a normal thing or not but when i gave it a little honey it like bent over and kneeled and like it was drinking water and is this a normal thing and another question is how much water do you give a chinese mantis and do you actually spray the mantis with the water for them to drink as well as the sides of its confinement?Does anyone think the trying to force feed a mantis too could cause more harm then good i know my mantids did not eat in a few days but dont want to force feed them if i dont have to and yes I know they know when its time to eat or not to but getting worried after like three days of eating nothing!

 

[Katnapper]

yes the kneeling is normal they bend down to drink and I also spray the mantid directly along with the side of the enclosure!

 

[AmandaLynn]

I wouldn't force feed her unless there's an obvious reason to, like she's incapable of catching her own food. Is she a sub-adult? I noticed that mine usually stopped eating, sometimes several days, like almost a full week before their final molt. Good luck with her.

 

[superfreak]

how do you force-feed a mantis?

 

[Katnapper]

how do you force-feed a mantis?

+1 :huh:

you can't "force-feed" a mantis it's like the old saying you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink please try not to worry about your mantis three days without eating is nothing especially if she is an adult most mantids can live up to two weeks without food just be sure to give her drinks each day and be patient she will eat when she is ready you just have to be patient and try not to worry!

 

[jameslongo]

+1 :huh: you can't "force-feed" a mantis it's like the old saying you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink please try not to worry about your mantis three days without eating is nothing especially if she is an adult most mantids can live up to two weeks without food just be sure to give her drinks each day and be patient she will eat when she is ready you just have to be patient and try not to worry!

+2.

Seems to be a common occurrence when mantids enter the latter part of their lives i guess they are preparing for the conception of a new generation and they neglect their own health to ensure conception (which could go either way if you ask me) this is not restricted to mantids mammals feel the sting too... AAAARGH!!! I can't do it any more! Neglecting grammar hurts too much. It burns my soul :lol: Anywho, here's a link about Mike the sea lion: Sea lion mates himself to death. Sad stuff.

 

[massaman]

shes still a sub adult and force feeding would be holding the mantis and trying to put a bug next to her mouth and try to get her to eat or grab then eat it but with a gentle nudge though!

 

[Katnapper]

shes still a sub adult and force feeding would be holding the mantis and trying to put a bug next to her mouth and try to get her to eat or grab then eat it but with a gentle nudge though!

massaman that's not really force-feeding but hand feeding if the mantis isn't ready or doesn't want to eat it won't you can't open it's mandibles and shove food in it just won't happen or work maybe using the term "hand feeding" would be a much better description oh and again please try not to worry!

 

[PhilinYuma]

massaman that's not really force-feeding but hand feeding if the mantis isn't ready or doesn't want to eat it won't you can't open it's mandibles and shove food in it just won't happen or work maybe using the term "hand feeding" would be a much better description oh and again please try not to worry!

Not strictly true, Katt, though it does require some work.

Method For Force Feeding Praying Mantis:

Place mantis in full lithotomy position on an adjustable Mantis Frame. Secure thorax and forelimbs with the attached straps.

Measure TBL of mantis.

Open Praying Mantis Force Feeding Kit. and find assigned number for mantis length on the enclosed card (eg , 2.5 cm = #1)

With a retractor, open the space between the epipharynx and hypopharynx and insert the lubricated feeding tube into cibarium.

If the pharynx is too constricted to allow passage of the tube, tickle the mantis between the eyes with a paintbrush until the pharanngeal dilator

muscles constrict, widening the pharynx.

Pass the tube into the crop until the apropriate number on the tube is level with the tip of the epipharynx.

Attach a funnel (do not use a syringe) to the distal end of the tube and pour in a small amount of honey and blended jalapenos.

Raise the level of the funnel above the mantis until the fluid flows into the crop.

When finished, remove the tube and let someone else clean up.

 

[AmandaLynn]

how do you force-feed a mantis?

Point taken. You can't "force-feed" a mantis. I should have said "hand-feed", I apologize for my poor choice of words. It was not my intention to cause any confusion.

 

[Katnapper]

Point taken. You can't "force-feed" a mantis. I should have said "hand-feed", I apologize for my poor choice of words. It was not my intention to cause any confusion.

You were only repeating massaman's term for it.

massaman hang in there I'm sure your mantis will eat soon!

 

[PhilinYuma]

You were only repeating massaman's term for it. massaman hang in there I'm sure your mantis will eat soon!

Yes, it's amazing the lengths that we normally sane (honest!) folks do for our mantids. I have six giant asians. Three of the males are adult, and as with the shields (shudder) two of the subs are female and one is male. When I was cleaning out the pot of the smaller female, she fell from the lid and lay still. I quickly lit a votive candle to the GMG, and fed her with some honey-on-a-stick which she took with a bit of coaxing. I then caught a fly, half drowned it and coated it with honey and fed it in the same way. She gobbled it down, so I shall only have to take one sleeper tonight.

By the way, Massaman, mantids normally get enough water from their food, either directly from their prey or from the oxidation of some of the food, but Chinese seem to enjoy drinking water more than any other mantis I have kept, and if yours had not had food for a few days, she was probably getting a little dehydrated.

 

[massaman]

I guess I am a worry wort but I just want to do the best to keep this pair alive and would do anything to keep them alive is all seems spraying the male does nothing really he has no interest in drinking at all and the female does a little bit more though and put in a cricket in her cage today and she kind of looked at it and kind of backed away a little bit and nothing else and tried to give her a fly with some honey on it and she did not want any of it she just tried to hold the shaft the fly was on and nothing more and i did get a little honey in her and on her arms and she did manage to lick the honey off her arms like a cat though and maybe this is what I need to do give her a little honey on her arms so she can lick it off and maybe eat it . Just not sure if this is something anyone else has tried when hand feeding does not work or shows lack of interest!

 

[Katnapper]

I know it's hard as you're hoping so very much to do everthing you can to insure the survival of these mantids but I think you may be worrying over nothing I'd advise you just relax and forget the thought that they're starving because they're not I believe you're trying too hard and making their lack of appetite right now out to be more than it is just offer them food each day try not to worry if they don't eat it right away and they will eat when ready maybe you're filling them up with honey and they're not hungry for the meat!

 

[PhilinYuma]

I know it's hard as you're hoping so very much to do everthing you can to insure the survival of these mantids but I think you may be worrying over nothing I'd advise you just relax and forget the thought that they're starving because they're not I believe you're trying too hard and making their lack of appetite right now out to be more than it is just offer them food each day try not to worry if they don't eat it right away and they will eat when ready maybe you're filling them up with honey and they're not hungry for the meat!

Yeah its hard not to worry about your mantids when you keep on looking at them hoping that they'll start looking better soon and they just keep on doing their thing in insect time but the more mantises you have the more these things are likely to come into perspective and your lucky if you have time to look at them a couple of times a day and usually they come out ok anyway.

 

[massaman]

well read this from bugnation bout vomiting and such wondering if anyone has any opinions on this too!

1, Poor Food source, dirty or diseased livefood.

2, Over feeding for extended periods of time

3, Keeping mantids at too colder temperature meaning they digest food too slowly which then rots in their gut.

4, Genetic problem due to too much inbreeding of Sp.

5, Handling you mantid with dirty hands causing a transfere of bacteria or chemicals making it sick.

6, Keeping your mantid in a dirty / unhygenic enclosure.

7, Feeding the same live food type without varying the diet.

It seems it can effect 1 indivdual or many.

some people have lost allot of their collection effected by it, others say 50% died and some say all recovered.

 

[Rick]

well read this from bugnation bout vomiting and such wondering if anyone has any opinions on this too!1, Poor Food source, dirty or diseased livefood.

2, Over feeding for extended periods of time

3, Keeping mantids at too colder temperature meaning they digest food too slowly which then rots in their gut.

4, Genetic problem due to too much inbreeding of Sp.

5, Handling you mantid with dirty hands causing a transfere of bacteria or chemicals making it sick.

6, Keeping your mantid in a dirty / unhygenic enclosure.

7, Feeding the same live food type without varying the diet.

It seems it can effect 1 indivdual or many.

some people have lost allot of their collection effected by it, others say 50% died and some say all recovered.

I agree with that list except for numbers 4, 5, and 7.

 

[PhilinYuma]

well read this from bugnation bout vomiting and such wondering if anyone has any opinions on this too!1, Poor Food source, dirty or diseased livefood.

2, Over feeding for extended periods of time

3, Keeping mantids at too colder temperature meaning they digest food too slowly which then rots in their gut.

4, Genetic problem due to too much inbreeding of Sp.

5, Handling you mantid with dirty hands causing a transfere of bacteria or chemicals making it sick.

6, Keeping your mantid in a dirty / unhygenic enclosure.

7, Feeding the same live food type without varying the diet.

It seems it can effect 1 indivdual or many.

some people have lost allot of their collection effected by it, others say 50% died and some say all recovered.

Ah Massaman! I think that the guesses hazarded in your list owe more to the need to explain a worrying mystery than to scientific evidence or even common sense.

1) Who in their right minds would feed their mantids "dirty or diseased livefood" (and I am talking here about hobbyists, not labs, where an assistant may feed large numbers of, say, crix, without checking them carefully)? How does an active "diseased" cric behave differently from a healthy one? Sounds like a post hoc argument to me.

2) This makes no sense. When a mantis is full, it stops eating. It is possible, though, that on a single occasion, particularly after a period of starvation a mantis might over eat enough to cause emesis. This is consistent with my experience, though not proven by it, and is contrary to the experimental evidence in the Prete book.

3) What a disgusting thought! And with no evidence whatsoever!

4) My vote for "guess at the bottom of the barrel" goes to this one. Is someone suggesting that there is a recessive gene for vomiting?

5&6) Sure. In the wild, mantids are famous for avoiding anything that is dirty or unhygenic. BTW, wouldn't this affect all of the mantids?

6) In a very tight field, this seems to be the most imagintive guess of all, and is certainly untrue from my own experience.

So why accept Christian's suggestions for the cause of this phenomenon? Because he and his colleagues are trained scientists. They may possibly be wrong, but their hypothoses are least reasoned and based on extensive experience.

BTW I noticed that you gave a reply by a Mantid Forum member on this subject on Bug Nation without citing your source. I am sure that this was accidental, since you cite your source here, but it really is a no,no. Perhaps you could edit your post there to give credit where it is due?