Hopefully Daisy is already fertile from poor Huey, if so then little Louie can keep a safe distance from her. It could very well be that she is a bit aggressive, or the males are simply so lost on the whole process Daisy looses her temper. At least Louie still has his head so he's fairing better so far.
Headless Popa spurca alive after five hours!
- Thread starter Deacon
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Deacon
Well-known member
Thomas, as of two days ago, Louie also lost his head. (I have been at the hospital with my 93 yr-old mom so mantids are taking a back seat.) He's still on her back and I don't know if he ever connected. The first couple of days, he would try to connect if I blew on him gently, but I never saw it happen in the short time I have checked on the mantids each day. Here I thought they were one of the more docile mantids. Not Daisy.
I have one ooth from her, before she ate Huey, and I don't know if it is fertile. I have assumed not. The first ooth was Feb 26 so she could be thinking about another ooth shortly.
Will a female eat another female just for the heck of it? It's only Daisy (57) and Doris (30) left in the big aquarium. Lots of room and twigs so they could avoid each other if they want to. Both girls are round like my pinkie and not bulging. Actually, Doris is almost as old as Daisy was when she layed her first ooth (at 34 days). But I know that neither male has been near Doris, during the day at least.
Goodness, I was just updating my mantid chart and realized that both Huey and Louie lost their heads at 21 days old!
I have one ooth from her, before she ate Huey, and I don't know if it is fertile. I have assumed not. The first ooth was Feb 26 so she could be thinking about another ooth shortly.
Will a female eat another female just for the heck of it? It's only Daisy (57) and Doris (30) left in the big aquarium. Lots of room and twigs so they could avoid each other if they want to. Both girls are round like my pinkie and not bulging. Actually, Doris is almost as old as Daisy was when she layed her first ooth (at 34 days). But I know that neither male has been near Doris, during the day at least.
Goodness, I was just updating my mantid chart and realized that both Huey and Louie lost their heads at 21 days old!
With your mom in the hospital I can't blame you, I wish you both the best.
Regarding Daisy, I wouldn't put it past her injuring/killing Doris at this point with two males under her belt it is hard to say if her aggression is purely from mating or just her normal attitude towards others. Although i would imagine it is due to mating as she has been getting aggressively lately - and they have all been housed together before adults right?
That is strange they both males lost their heads on the same day. Sounds like you will have to hope the males were able to successfully bred with one if not both females, or try to find some more males to bred again.
Regarding Daisy, I wouldn't put it past her injuring/killing Doris at this point with two males under her belt it is hard to say if her aggression is purely from mating or just her normal attitude towards others. Although i would imagine it is due to mating as she has been getting aggressively lately - and they have all been housed together before adults right?
That is strange they both males lost their heads on the same day. Sounds like you will have to hope the males were able to successfully bred with one if not both females, or try to find some more males to bred again.
Deacon
Well-known member
Thomas,
Doris was moved to a safer home a few days ago! That Daisy, the cannibal, had her trapped in the crotch of a grouping of twigs. At first, I thought Doris was dead since she was so contorted but I ushered Daisy to the opposite end of the tank and gently got Doris out of her predicament---took some doing! She is gravid with her first ooth so her abdomen really got caught in the twigs and being so heavy she was literally stuck there. She is now settling quite nicely in the tank with my ghost female on one side (who layed her 2nd ooth yesterday) and my lonely Hierodula male on her other side. (I am really enjoying my triple-divided ten gallon tanks.)
Maybe Daisy was harassing her because they are both gravid? Or maybe she is just not nice. Daisy had just turned adult when I put the four Popas together. The others were sub-adults. Anyway, she will now live out her life in an 18 gallon home all by herself!
Doris was moved to a safer home a few days ago! That Daisy, the cannibal, had her trapped in the crotch of a grouping of twigs. At first, I thought Doris was dead since she was so contorted but I ushered Daisy to the opposite end of the tank and gently got Doris out of her predicament---took some doing! She is gravid with her first ooth so her abdomen really got caught in the twigs and being so heavy she was literally stuck there. She is now settling quite nicely in the tank with my ghost female on one side (who layed her 2nd ooth yesterday) and my lonely Hierodula male on her other side. (I am really enjoying my triple-divided ten gallon tanks.)
Maybe Daisy was harassing her because they are both gravid? Or maybe she is just not nice. Daisy had just turned adult when I put the four Popas together. The others were sub-adults. Anyway, she will now live out her life in an 18 gallon home all by herself!
Hard to say what Daisy's intentions were, but even the most communal species still will cannibalize randomly. A reason many keepers will keep all mantids in their own habitats, as why chance losing one. I'm the same way and after my nymphs molt to L2 they are then separated individually. Although it sounds like Daisy revels in the act itself, perhaps she just wants to be left alone.
Glad to hear Doris will be happy in her new setup.
Also congrats on finding her in time and getting her out safely, it definitely sounds like you saved your girl.
Glad to hear Doris will be happy in her new setup.
Also congrats on finding her in time and getting her out safely, it definitely sounds like you saved your girl.
mantisman 230
Well-known member
At least your male will connect without a head xD, I'm trying to breed Rhombodera fusca and my male has yet to properly mate with his head attached. And yet he sat on a female for two days and no connection xD.
Deacon
Well-known member
Oh, Thomas, Doris dropped dead two days after I posted her removal from the communal tank. I guess she did get injured but I didn't see any green blood or holes anywhere on her. Too bad as she was only 50 days old and gravid. I don't believe either of the males ever bred with her though. She was brown and Daisy is almost black so they were identifiable.
Daisy is now past-due for laying a second ooth. Her first was layed at 34 days (assumed infertile) and that was 47 days ago. Considering she killed two males on her back, I assume her next ooth could be fertile so I search her habitat every day. Now that she is alone, I am going to remove many of the twigs today as it is kind a a jungle (meant to provide hiding spots when the four of them were together).
Daisy is now past-due for laying a second ooth. Her first was layed at 34 days (assumed infertile) and that was 47 days ago. Considering she killed two males on her back, I assume her next ooth could be fertile so I search her habitat every day. Now that she is alone, I am going to remove many of the twigs today as it is kind a a jungle (meant to provide hiding spots when the four of them were together).
Sorry to hear she didn't make it Nancy. Perhaps Doris was internally injured in a location where any entrance wound sealed itself back somewhat, or was small enough there was no noticeable blood. Either way two days of her incident with Daisy, it's extremely likely something happened.
As I only had a few Popa's as nymphs (they had a rough shipment and died within days of arriving), so I am not sure of their time between ooths - but that seems like a excessive long period between ooths. How long did it take her on the first ooth after molting to a adult? That might give a clue as to a time-frame, after subtracting about 3 weeks. One person who would know is dmina, but I haven't seen her on in awhile.
Indeed, sounds like a good idea so you can find her ooth to see what is going on.
Perhaps Doris was internally injured in a location where any entrance wound sealed itself back somewhat, or was small enough there was no noticeable blood. Either way two days of her incident with Daisy, it's extremely likely something happened.As I only had a few Popa's as nymphs (they had a rough shipment and died within days of arriving), so I am not sure of their time between ooths - but that seems like a excessive long period between ooths. How long did it take her on the first ooth after molting to a adult? That might give a clue as to a time-frame, after subtracting about 3 weeks. One person who would know is dmina, but I haven't seen her on in awhile.
Indeed, sounds like a good idea so you can find her ooth to see what is going on.
