help! My Adonis is dying of unexplained illness

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sk8erkho

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Look at this pic



He was absolutely fine all day and just an hour ago I noticed he was losing control of his extremities. I picked him up he clinged to my finger as if he could not control his grip I had to pry hes claw from my finger. I gave him water he drank almst his body size and then appeared to spit it back up. He is not literally stuck to my finger and may be dying. I know there is nothing I can do but what could have caused this. i did have to lay down Diatomaceous earth in the bed room but vaccumed it all up today and he was not even near the bed room. I am at a loss. Any ideas? Notice the hind legs

 
sk8erkho said:
Look at this pic

He was absolutely fine all day and just an hour ago I noticed he was losing control of his extremities. I picked him up he clinged to my finger as if he could not control his grip I had to pry hes claw from my finger. I gave him water he drank almst his body size and then appeared to spit it back up. He is not literally stuck to my finger and may be dying. I know there is nothing I can do but what could have caused this. i did have to lay down Diatomaceous earth in the bed room but vaccumed it all up today and he was not even near the bed room. I am at a loss. Any ideas? Notice the hind legs
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I went back and checked yr old posts, and this is the second time that you have appled diatomaceous earth and the second time that you have had a sick mantid with similar symptoms, and in this case, serious dehydration that typifies poisoning from D.E. For my money, that's the cause. It's really sad, but at least you know how to stop it from happening again.

 
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You should keep giving it water, but if it's drinking so much that it's spitting it back up, try giving it very small amounts frequently. Don't let it drink so much all at once. Hope it starts feeling better.

 
I'm also thinking the Diatomaceous earth could be your problem, Khori. I too remembered the last time you had mantids dying when you put it down. It would seem just having your mantids in a seperate room isn't enough to keep it from affecting them.

Also... look at your fingers! This really struck me when I looked at the pic. The skin of your finger is very dry and you can see the detail of your fingerprints and individual wrinkles, etc. really well! Maybe the DE is causing this effect on your hands and fingers from using it, or being around it. If so, just think of how much moisture it would suck out of a little mantis. I'm not sure about the method of delivery.... air, you touching the mantis after working with the DE, etc. ... but it's a compelling theory.

 
Sadly, Katt, it's even worse than having the diatomaceous earth absorbing the mantis's moisture. If that were the case, it might be possible to wash it clean with a painbrush. The cuticle of insects is covered by what I was taught was a "waxy" (really lipid) layer that keeps it "waterproof." The DE strips off that layer, so the insect is like someone with second (or even first, I guess) degree burns over his entire body, just leaking fluid. Poor Adonis doesn't stand a chance, I'm afraid.

 
Diatomaceous earth kills insects. Quit using that around your mantids!

 
I went back and checked yr old posts, and this is the second time that you have appled diatomaceous earth and the second time that you have had a sick mantid with similar symptoms, and in this case, serious dehydration that typifies poisoning from D.E. For my money, that's the cause. It's really sad, but at least you know how to stop it from happening again
Click to expand...
You may be right,Phil! However, early yesterday morning I vaccumed the room that was treated two weeks ago thougoughly as I was cleaning. I opened the windows, turned on the overhead fan (possible culprit) and closed the door, then,stuffed a towel under the door to hopefully keep any dust from escaping out to the rest of the apartment. He was really no where near the room actually. I then changed the clothes bagged em and washed up thougoughly (regular proceedure after applying DE). then I went in to mate him and he was fine. It wasn't until later last night that he began to show symptoms of dehydration.

Also... look at your fingers! This really struck me when I looked at the pic. The skin of your finger is very dry and you can see the detail of your fingerprints and individual wrinkles, etc. really well! Maybe the DE is causing this effect on your hands and fingers from using it, or being around it. If so, just think of how much moisture it would suck out of a little mantis. I'm not sure about the method of delivery.... air, you touching the mantis after working with the DE, etc. ... but it's a compelling theory
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And absolutely, Katnapper, I washed my hands in warm water with lots and lots of soap to the point of Chappedness!!!! I then picked him up grabed my camera and shot off what you guys saw. When I saw he was dying on me I figured hydration may help him so, I misted him from head to claw, fed him as much water as he could hold to the point where it appeared he was spitting it back up. Then I put a clean paper slightly moist paper towel in the bottom of this carry out butterfly kit my little man gave me and left him on a thick branch in there over night. This morning before I left out he look a lot better. When I returned home this afternoon he was doing GREAT!!!! I knew what DE was composed of and what made it an insect or any thing with an exoskeltons' worst enemy. Which is why I tried especially, after the first incident with my mantids and DE, to excercise very exact and thourough clean proceedures while using that stuff. It's really bad news for insects but it's great news for bedbugs!!! So. with all this let me tell you guys that he is doing GREAT now!!! :p WHEW!! Now, I am going next door to my neighbor's and tear them a new butt hole as they were told to report even One bedbug. I found out from th enot too bright teenager that they had been seeing a few but "nothing much to worry about?" It's clear they know nothing about their breeding habits as well as their ability to travel the world to the point of causing pandemic levels of infestation. I am now caught in a bad place because if it gets the way it was over there where the bedbugs were so bad they were at record levels all throughtout their apt and that one fam single handedly infested the entire building by frequenting their other friends apt.s here in the building.

So thanks,all, for you input and I guess I will have to find alternative means to fight off the bedbugs should it get nasty around here. I just have a problem with the exterminator roaming through my crib spraying walls to floor and whatnot. I know they don't develop tolerance to the DE and it has been Really effective on keeping them down. This is the first incident since the last one,so....???????

 
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Hey just caught this post, the de works by getting inside their skin so to speak and does not work right away, it takes a little time to kill them, not only dehydrates but grates their insides each time they move, not like a spray that would kill within a few minutes. Also I hav a spray that is absolutly safe to use, not on the mantis,,,,dear me, but on the bed! It is almost the only thing that kills bed bugs and is used in every hospital on the beds too. it dries in about 20 minutes and also kills mites, once it dries it is not able to kill anything which is what makes it safe. Let me know if you are interested, I havent put on site yet, but it runs about 13 to 15 for a pint bottle which goes a long way, use on your fruit fly culture cups with the lids covered up, or where they sit to kill mites and on pillows, beds, chairs, carpets and so forth. I love the de, but cannot use it no more, the vacume blows it all over and is so tiny particals, we do not notice it, but they do.

 
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You cant tell the difference between a male and a female mantid? Come on.... theres a sticky on this stuff! You have live specimens at your disposal! Do some work mate! ;)

 
Let's just put this topic to bed, shall we? Congrats on the recovery, Khori!

 
superfreak said:
You cant tell the difference between a male and a female mantid? Come on.... theres a sticky on this stuff! You have live specimens at your disposal! Do some work mate! ;)
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I can tell the difference. It's just hard with a blurry picture of a sick mantis with a fat abdomen. I can tell a mantid's sex as early as L5, and this is only the beginning of my 4th rearing year!

 

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