Sticks or no sticks for molting?

[Deacon]

I have a Hierodula, sub-adult, who is getting ready for that final molt. She is in a 32 oz cup about 6 " tall, organza with shelf liner on the lid and 1/2" heavy plastic mesh encircling her cup. No sticks or decoration. I was planning on moving her into an 80 oz, decorated home before the molt, but now I'm wondering if I should wait.

When a mantis molts from the lid, moving more and more downward as it molts, does it want/need something to grab a hold of at some point? Do they drop to the floor when they're ready or bend up and catch the lid or sides of the container? (I had a Chinese mantis that bumped into her decorations and had a horrible final molt and I don't want a repeat.)

I just don't know what is best....some sticks far enough under her that she could grasp toward the end of the molt, or a clean cup without obstructions. I know she won't be as large as the Chinese but it's hard to guess her final size and how would I gauge the correct amount of room to leave her?

How do you prepare for the final molt?

 

[LAME]

Personally I wouldn't let her molt in a 32oz..I use 10 gallon aquariums for my crew.

But If the 32oz is the last resort. Remove the sticks.. I've noticed they use their old skin as the "stepping stone" to reach whatever safe structure they can grasp. (Usually the lid.)

 

[Ranitomeya]

My experience is that 32 oz cups can be very bad places for large mantises to molt into adulthood. If they molt near a wall and end up with their backs against it, they'll try to grip it and end up either falling or bending their limbs by hanging in an awkward position. The fabric on the lids also have a tendency to provide poor grip since there are a high number of loose fibers that can cause a fall. I usually hotglue paper towel to the lids as they're less likely to fall from that. The smooth surface and curvature of the cups also increases the chance of bent limbs since they'll often be unable to grip and will just hang with a legs bent against the walls.

Sticks work well, but not when glued to lids as mantises tend to try wrap their tarsi around the sticks--they don't just grip the surface of the stick.

 

[Deacon]

Lame and Ranitomeya,

Thanks for your input. I'm moving the Hierodula fem, a pair of Double Shields, and a Budwing fem---all subs---to roomier surroundings momentarily. I appreciate your shared experiences.

All my enclosures are organza lids with that spongy-feeling, bubbly, shelf liner glued to it. That is what is also in the 32 oz. containers and they hang from it all the time so hopefully it will continue to work for them.

And, surprise, surprise! My male ghost molted to adult last night--doesn't look like a pinecone anymore! What a difference.

Nancy

 

[MantidBro]

Lame and Ranitomeya,

Thanks for your input. I'm moving the Hierodula fem, a pair of Double Shields, and a Budwing fem---all subs---to roomier surroundings momentarily. I appreciate your shared experiences.

All my enclosures are organza lids with that spongy-feeling, bubbly, shelf liner glued to it. That is what is also in the 32 oz. containers and they hang from it all the time so hopefully it will continue to work for them.

And, surprise, surprise! My male ghost molted to adult last night--doesn't look like a pinecone anymore! What a difference.

Nancy

Shelf liner is a perfect molting surface. I usually align the sides of their containers with it as well. Some mantids will use their exuvia to get up, others will try to use the side of the container. If there is nothing to grasp when they try to use the side, they may fall. So I would align the side of the container with the shelf liner as well. Congrats on your male ghost!

 

[Deacon]

MantidBro,

When I built the 80 oz homes, I glued that black, 1/2" plastic mesh to one end and the back of the container, hoping the mantis is smart enough to molt in the right spot. I mean, how do they ever manage on their own in the wild? If I glued the shelf liner on the sides, the only way to see what's going on inside is to open the lid and all the flies that are present get out. I had an old Chinese male that I surrounded all four walls of his Critter Keeper with black shelf liner (I dislike those lids so much, that device is in the garage forevermore.) He seemed to hate his cage after that and I don't blame him as it must have felt like a dark cave. After a week, I ripped most of it out except for a 1" band about midway up the sides. And, most importantly, I went out and bought a roll of white shelf liner for the new nymphs! That black roll is in the garage, too!

How do you see inside yours? I know several people have recommended lining the walls with paper towels or shelf liner but how do you enjoy looking at that, not knowing what;s happening inside?

 

[MantidBro]

MantidBro,

When I built the 80 oz homes, I glued that black, 1/2" plastic mesh to one end and the back of the container, hoping the mantis is smart enough to molt in the right spot. I mean, how do they ever manage on their own in the wild? If I glued the shelf liner on the sides, the only way to see what's going on inside is to open the lid and all the flies that are present get out. I had an old Chinese male that I surrounded all four walls of his Critter Keeper with black shelf liner (I dislike those lids so much, that device is in the garage forevermore.) He seemed to hate his cage after that and I don't blame him as it must have felt like a dark cave. After a week, I ripped most of it out except for a 1" band about midway up the sides. And, most importantly, I went out and bought a roll of white shelf liner for the new nymphs! That black roll is in the garage, too!

How do you see inside yours? I know several people have recommended lining the walls with paper towels or shelf liner but how do you enjoy looking at that, not knowing what;s happening inside?

I cut out the lid with a razor and replace it with screen netting which you can see into and out of. Most of my enclosures are designed with molting in mind. It may not be as pleasant but it keeps them from mismolting. But they still get to have time out of the cage, for feeding and exploring. Plus once they are adults, molts are no longer a worry and they can get the nice natural cages.Oh i should add that i stand my cages vertically, not horizontally as they were intended.

 

[LAME]

When it comes to the deli cups and shelvelining... What I do is hot glue 3/4 of the deli. (75%.)

Thus, a majority of that cups wall's is covered by liner... Yet you still have an open wall for the human's enjoyment.

I also use mantidbro's mentioned methods for my lids.

Aaaaaand.... In my collection thread there's a post in regards to my Idolomantis current setup. Its a 10 gallon tank standing upright. The insides are completely covered in liner, plus a homemade screen lid. That may help you in a new build....

Hope this helps, pm me if you need help.

Edited: I just check my collection thread. Its on page 11.

 

[Deacon]

Wow! Lucky mantids that get a 10 gal aquarium to themselves! I could do that if I only had a couple mantids. Right now, I'm checking out 6 species of which I am partial to the Hierodula and Sphodromantids---still loving my first mantids though (Chinese). After all these have lived their lives and I pick a favorite species, I have room for 2 to 4 aquariums on end max. So, do you only feed them outside their tanks?

LAME, I've made a note to check your thread again at that time. That's quite the arrangement you've come up with. What is the bright light shining through the side of your build (page 11)?

 

[LAME]

Lol I've owned many species So far.. Including the three you've mentioned. Honestly so far the largest I've seen was the Chinese mantis.

You can make a divider and split a 10g tank in half, thus making 2 separate homes with each tank and the mantids will still have plenty of room for sheds.

With me... Feeding varies? Sometimes I'll remove them... Sometimes I won't. I guess for me It really depends on the mantis... If it's willing to come say hi, I'll bring it out for the meal. Otherwise they eat at home. I used to just throw food in their homes and let them hunt, but I've been catching myself hand feeding lately.

Concerning "Crowley's Castle."... Its just a regular desk lamp I picked up at Wal-Mart. Its one of those computer desk lamps with the flexiheads. Usually sustains Crowley's home around 80 degrees, but can go higher or lower depending on how close it is... I think it was around 7 dollars?

....But you can probably find a cheaper one at a dollarstore.

 

[Deacon]

Lame, by flexihead lamps do you mean those gooseneck types? Do you know the wattage of the bulb that gives you that much warmth?

Re the big aquariums, aren't you sort of forced to hand feed (lots of space for feeders to hide in)?

About the feeding, I asked because if you put flies in those 10 gal aquariums, doesn't that make opening the front difficult if the mantis didn't eat them all? I have several subadults who decided to stop eating right after I gave them their daily ration of BB flies a few days ago. I know I should get them out of there but it is a hassle chasing escapees. The BB flies head for the sky light but the house flies disappear! (My husband is real quick to let me know that one of my flies is loose.)

I actually don't think it is as much fun having 14 mantids at one time because feeding them is very impersonal since there isn't enough time to hand feed. My Chinese were so tame and fun ---plus they were on the kitchen counter so they were in my space and vice versa. Now, I've had to move the "bugs" upstairs to their own room and I only spend a couple of hours each day caring for them which means three usually get hand fed and the rest get food tossed in which makes me feel like a bad parent ignoring some of the kids.

Speaking of the kids, woke up to three more adults this morning: male and female Budwings and the male Hierodula all molted perfectly, yay! I'm waiting on the Double Shields and female Hierodula subadults still. Then there is the female Ghost but I read that can take 2-3 months from sub to adult (the male molted in exactly a month from sub to adult which is why I was so surprised.)

About dividing tanks; too bad the larger ones don't have the little notches pre-built like those small tanks. Then again, what's to keep the mantids from climbing into each others space when the one big lid comes off?

Hey, I appreciate your input as always. Gotta stop this. Busy day tomorrow! Happy Holidays!