temperature and release (newbie question)

[scriabin]

Hi everybody!

This is my first post. I recently thought it would be fun to order a chinese mantis ootheca and hatch it. The person who sold it to me told me that eventually the nymphs would start to eat each other, but not to worry because they are legal to release in the USA.

Well, they hatched, ahead of schedule, and have more than doubled in size and... have started eating each other. It seems wrong to keep them in a confined space which encourages them to turn on each other ... but I'm worried that the weather is too cold and if I release them, they'll die. I'm in the LA area - temps are pretty mild relatively speaking - usually 55-70 during the days - but at night it can reach and sometimes even dip below 40 degrees. Does anyone know if they'll be able to make it in these temperatures, and if not - what do you think is the ethical thing to do??

Thanks!

Jonathan

 

[Peter Clausen]

Hi Jonathan,

I'd personally separate them into vials and feed them invidividually with fruit flies and then graduate them to house flies around 3rd instar. That might not be an option for you though, time-wise.

You could further subdivide them into a few more containers and add a bunch of diversions like the excelsior product. This stuff or even just leaves, etc. help to increase surface area within the container, hopefully reducing feeding on one another. Still, they will find each other. But do remember that the reason 200 nymphs come out of an egg case is so that only a few would make it to maturity in the wild. The ethical counterpoint is that your raising them not in the wild and so each life has a greater chance of living.

Feed them a ton of fruit flies daily and it will make them view each other less as a meal.

I'd feel more comfortable with releasing them if they were 2nd or better yet, 3rd instar. Since they're feeding on each other, I suspect they are probably at least 2nd instar by now. Your low outdoor temps are just about the bottom threshold of what they can tolerate, however the real issue is the fact that they might not have any prey to eat out there this time of year. You might base this decision on how many flies, etc. you see outdoors during the day.

It is correct that you can release them. They are sold by the gardening industry as beneficial insect predators of unwanted pests.

 

[sk8erkho]

Yep!!! Peter is right. I was unable at the time to order the excelsior so I went out and grabbed up bunches of Evergreen which was planted on our complex and then filled my 15 gal. tank with it plus much branches and that artificial vine with leaves and it dramatically cut down on the feeding frenzy I observed when first I hatched my Chinese ooth. First time I went from about 200 to 75 then down to 30, no kidding in no time when they began to molt to L2-3 it was a real frenzy in there. I felt bad and thought it was my fault. Also, like Peter said also, fruit flies, man!!1 Much fruit flies!! :lol:

 

[Rick]

Wrong time of year to release them.

 

[kamakiri]

It's not the right time to release them, but if you only want to keep 2 or 3 adults, then letting some of them go would probably be better. Even though it's slim pickin's outside, there are still insects in my back yard for a mantis to eat.

Besides, it's about 76 degrees today At least it is in the O.C.! Even had the convertible top down for lunch...and winter has just started!

 

[scriabin]

Thanks for the advice everyone - I've divided them into a couple different containers for now, but if they remain aggressive I will start releasing them. I know they'll do fine during the day, it's just that at night it can get down around 40 degrees. I'm not worried about them finding food though - there is never a shortage of bugs in Southern California - I was more worried about the mantids because I don't know much about the climate in China where they are from.

 

[nasty bugger]

If you're keeping them in a 15 gallon tank they're probably having a more difficult time catching fruitflies, and may be starving enough to eat each other. I'd try to keep them in a smaller area, when you single them out, so they can catch the prey easier.

I didn't have any problems with them eating each other, till I had the second ootheca hatch in the same jar as some older, L2 or L3's, then the older one's started killing the newbies, but not each other, so I wonder if it was hunger or just territorialism.

I'd say your's are just plain hungry, and getting them enough food that they can catch and eat would probably help.

 

[shorty]

Wrong time of year to release them.

Ditto.