Cruelty to animals! Report this video...

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Thanks for the heads up, Precarious. I reported it for cruelty, but didn't post because the little .... (fill in your own word so that I don't get a warning point!) seems to get off on being insulted. Looking at him, I would guess that he has a cluster of psych problems (but no, that is no excuse). I saw that he had two arms bands on his right wrist. Perhaps he is an escapee from an adolescent psych unit. Perhaps they'll come after him. Perhaps he'll put up a struggle. Well, we can dream, can't we?

I do strongly suggest that members turn it off after the first few seconds. It doesn't get any more edifying as it progresses.

 
Thanks for the heads up, Precarious. I reported it for cruelty, but didn't post because the little .... (fill in your own word so that I don't get a warning point!) seems to get off on being insulted. Looking at him, I would guess that he has a cluster of psych problems (but no, that is no excuse). I saw that he had two arms bands on his right wrist. Perhaps he is an escapee from an adolescent psych unit. Perhaps they'll come after him. Perhaps he'll put up a struggle. Well, we can dream, can't we?

I do strongly suggest that members turn it off after the first few seconds. It doesn't get any more edifying as it progresses.
Absolutely agree. They love that people are disgusted by their cruelty. I didn't comment either. What's the point? Just flag and contact YouTube.

To be completely honest I watched very little of the video, but I saw more than enough to make me angry and disappointed in these poor, devolved examples of humanity.

 
Good lord he sounds like Dr. Heinz Doofenshmirtz from Phineas and Firb.

 
dang sorry about that Peter i guess i lost it there....should have reflected a bit more on my words before i said it...not trying to justify my crude use of language but i was really just disgusted out of my mind that people like that actually exist. i take back the terrible things i said they were over the top but i will not take back my opinion of them. if by any chance i came across someone doing anything remotely as cruel as that i cannot truthfully tell you that i will just continue on my way or ask how their day was.

 
Where is this kids parents! I wish I knew where this kid lived!
His parents won't care. Remember, they RAISED him to be this kind of cruel person! A kid wouldn't just naturally be drawn to killing critters...I don't THINK. :blink:

Now to play the "devil's advocate" for a moment...how many of us have uploaded pics or videos of headless males mounting females? Or headless males/cagemates wandering around in their enclosures. As creepy as we find it, we must also find it fascinating/amusing on some level to want to share that with others, or watch it ourselves.

Now, how many of us have "stomped" a mismolt, rather than try to handfeed...or rather than freeze them relatively painlessly? How many of us have fed a mantis to another animal (frog, tarantula, chameleon, etc)?

"Let he who has not sinned cast the first stone."

While I definitely do NOT agree with this type of casual abuse to an animal...I think it rather hypocritical of us to be just as vulgar & cruel to this misguided (and quite possibly mental) kid. Besides, as mentioned, the kid seems to "get off" on it.

That being said, I hope he meets the same fate as that mantis a thousand times in the underworld. :p (Yes, I flagged it...but honestly, YouTube is probably not going to do a darn thing about it!)

 
His parents won't care. Remember, they RAISED him to be this kind of cruel person! A kid wouldn't just naturally be drawn to killing critters...I don't THINK. :blink:

Now to play the "devil's advocate" for a moment...how many of us have uploaded pics or videos of headless males mounting females? Or headless males/cagemates wandering around in their enclosures. As creepy as we find it, we must also find it fascinating/amusing on some level to want to share that with others, or watch it ourselves.

Now, how many of us have "stomped" a mismolt, rather than try to handfeed...or rather than freeze them relatively painlessly? How many of us have fed a mantis to another animal (frog, tarantula, chameleon, etc)?

"Let he who has not sinned cast the first stone."

While I definitely do NOT agree with this type of casual abuse to an animal...I think it rather hypocritical of us to be just as vulgar & cruel to this misguided (and quite possibly mental) kid. Besides, as mentioned, the kid seems to "get off" on it.

That being said, I hope he meets the same fate as that mantis a thousand times in the underworld. :p (Yes, I flagged it...but honestly, YouTube is probably not going to do a darn thing about it!)
Lots of interesting points, here, Carey. I agree that parents can teach cruelty by their own words and example. Sometimes, perhaps often, though, the bad behavior is a result of neglect. I knew a 7 year old in SF whose GM and mother both told me how he loved insects. Nobody observed him, though. He was tirelessly catching insects so that he could toss them into spiders' webs to enjoy them being eaten (we wouldn't enjoy something like that, would we?), and that was the extent of his interest. It was I, not mom or GM who found him two blocks away from the house where he wouldn't be seen, merrily burning ants with a magnifying glass (it was my magnifier, too, darn it!). He knew it was wrong, so I made a deal with him, either I could tell his mom, ("No! Don't do that!") or teach him what he was doing. I held the focused light beam on his arm until he jumped. I don't think that he did that again, at least i never caught him, and I kept my magnifier locked up! I suspect that casual cruelty is a common human trait, think of slavery, think of soldiers in battle, think of schoolyard bullies, and kids need to be taught that it is wrong.

I too have seriously wondered about folks whose major interest in mantids is their killing and eating ability. i have no doubt that when a mantis eats a reptile or a fish, it is not being "cruel" to the victim, but I wonder about folks who focus exclusively on that part of their mantids' marvelous and varied behavior.

I have mentioned before that I had the run of a pet store in Chicago where a couple of times a week, customers would buy a goldfish and wait until after closing time when the water in the piranha tank was heated and they got to see their goldfish torn apart by the hungry predators I never watched the slaughter, but I did watch the spectators, and to quote the late, great Phil Ochs, "saliva was running from their smiles". Two sessions of that was enough for me. One new member here once stated that he had been raising a Chinese mantis for the sole purpose (Honest! He said that!) of warching it eat a pinky. Fortunately, Rick squished him before he could share the gruesome details. And BTW, have you noticed how many mantiseers also keep reptiles, instead of, say, bunny rabbits? I wonder what that is all about?!

I never hand feed crippled mantids.If they have a trait that gives them an increased tendency to mismolt, say, then we are artificially preserving that trait in the progeny. Someone mentioned that lines of long domesticated angelfish have lost the ability to care for their young. Forty years ago, part of the fun of raising this cichlid was watching the parents catching up their fry and spitting them into an area of safety. Now, though, many breeders raise the young without their parents, and many fish that would have died out in nature, spawn parents that lack the ability. I also think that a crippled mantis is not enjoying a very high "quality of life". I believe in euthanasia for humans, too!

So, brick or freezer? The brick method has a large "urghh" factor for some of us, and I would suggest that anyone who is squeamish shouldn't do it, but it is quicker than freezing, where the mantis dies relatively slowly, in the dark, abandoned by his/her sibs and owner! I guess that it depends on your point of view! I suspect that the freezer method is often used for the comfort of the owner than for the mantis "out of sight, out of mind".

Thank you for a thought provoking post! I hope that it produces a lot of discussion, and that that cretinous youth did some good, however inadvertently. :D

 
"Let he who has not sinned cast the first stone."
Maybe it's just me but I see a tremendous difference between documenting what occurs as part of a natural process outside of our control (such as a female partially eating her mate) and documenting your friend torturing and murdering a defenseless animal. I think it's pretty insulting to even draw any comparison between the two.

We've all got some level of morbid curiosity and I'd like to learn everything I can about my pets. Since there is no undoing what has been done by an over-eager female why not learn what we can from an unfortunate incident?

I can say from personal experience that putting one of my pets down is an emotionally traumatic experience. I've fed more than my share of crippled mantids hoping they would recover after their next molt. I've got to say it has never ended well. Whatever method is used to put them down is not pleasant, but better that than see them suffer as they starve to death.

I think you've taken the cruel, indefensible acts committed in this video and twisted them into a means of trying to make everyone here feel guilty about some unfortunate necessities that come along with keeping mantids, and I think that's a bunch of cr@p!

 
Maybe it's just me but I see a tremendous difference between documenting what occurs as part of a natural process outside of our control (such as a female partially eating her mate) and documenting your friend torturing and murdering a defenseless animal. I think it's pretty insulting to even draw any comparison between the two.

We've all got some level of morbid curiosity and I'd like to learn everything I can about my pets. Since there is no undoing what has been done by an over-eager female why not learn what we can from an unfortunate incident?

I can say from personal experience that putting one of my pets down is an emotionally traumatic experience. I've fed more than my share of crippled mantids hoping they would recover after their next molt. I've got to say it has never ended well. Whatever method is used to put them down is not pleasant, but better that than see them suffer as they starve to death.

I think you've taken the cruel, indefensible acts committed in this video and twisted them into a means of trying to make everyone here feel guilty about some unfortunate necessities that come along with keeping mantids, and I think that's a bunch of cr@p!
^This I agree completely. Unfortunately I've met kids who threatened to kill mantids just to spite me. Of course I would tell them that they're aiding the cockroach population. But the point is, there are some ignorant, misguided, and demented individuals out there. Unfortunately, this is a prime example (albeit low level example) of how crazy people can be. Phil I'm surprised you didn't hold a candle for the Great Mantis Goddess (BBHN) for the poor mantis to rest in peace and to maybe spite those two.

 
Ah Mantidlord. Mantids rest in peace, whether we light a candle or not, and they don't have souls, any more than we do.Since they have no voices, they don't really miss not being able to "spend eternity singing around the throne". It made absolutely no difference to the Great Mantis Goddess (BbHN) or the mantis itself whether it was destroyed by a bird, a flood or a human boy.

I mentioned the anger that the video had caused me and many members, and she suggested that it would be more productive if we expressed our anger about the children being shot, burned and crushed tight now in Tripolii.. She wondered why humans are so enraged about the things that we cannot change and so indifferent to the things we can. I changed the subject.

 
He said most things better than we can think or feel them (I think)...

Henry David Thoreau says:

Moreover, when at the pond, I wished sometimes to add fish to my fare for variety. I have actually fished from the same kind of necessity that the first fishers did. Whatever humanity I might conjure up against it was all factitious, and concerned my philosophy more than my feelings. I speak of fishing only now, for I had long felt differently about fowling, and sold my gun before I went to the woods. Not that I am less humane than others, but I did not perceive that my feelings were much affected. I did not pity the fishes nor the worms. This was habit. As for fowling, during the last years that I carried a gun my excuse was that I was studying ornithology, and sought only new or rare birds. But I confess that I am now inclined to think that there is a finer way of studying ornithology than this. It requires so much closer attention to the habits of the birds, that, if for that reason only, I have been willing to omit the gun. Yet notwithstanding the objection on the score of humanity, I am compelled to doubt if equally valuable sports are ever substituted for these; and when some of my friends have asked me anxiously about their boys, whether they should let them hunt, I have answered, yes, -- remembering that it was one of the best parts of my education, -- make them hunters, though sportsmen only at first, if possible, mighty hunters at last, so that they shall not find game large enough for them in this or any vegetable wilderness, -- hunters as well as fishers of men.

...

There is a period in the history of the individual, as of the race, when the hunters are the "best men," -- as the Algonquins called them. We cannot but pity the boy who has never fired a gun; he is no more humane, while his education has been sadly neglected. This was my answer with respect to those youths who were bent on this pursuit, trusting that they would soon outgrow it. No humane being, past the thoughtless age of boyhood, will wantonly murder any creature which holds its life by the same tenure that he does.

 

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