Idolomantis Consolidated

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Well whatever you do DON'T add a bunch of sticks !!! :lol:

But in your rigs maybe you could hot glue a bunch of sponges(reg dishwash rectangle ones) 5-6 inches apart all over the top so they hang down, they come in colors, then they can reach over to help flip when there ready, and they would also detour anybody wanting to take advantage of a easy snack. the Idea being 6-10 per square foot hanging long ways down parallel so you can still see in?

 
angelofdeathzz said:
Well whatever you do DON'T add a bunch of sticks !!! :lol:
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Hardee-Har-Har. <_<

angelofdeathzz said:
But in your rigs maybe you could hot glue a bunch of sponges(reg dishwash rectangle ones) 5-6 inches apart all over the top so they hang down, they come in colors, then they can reach over to help flip when there ready, and they would also detour anybody wanting to take advantage of a easy snack. the Idea being 6-10 per square foot hanging long ways down parallel so you can still see in?
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Interesting. I had wanted to do them projecting upwards, but that might work as well (or better). I'll start hacking away tonight or tomorrow.

 
BTW, this image shows what is probably my favorite, and most stable approach to heating and lighting for these guys. I've got 2 lights mounted above the enclosure (on timers or on/off switches). Fairly consistent temps above 75F at the bottom, mid 80's at the top (with the A/C on).

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I suspect they're better off hotter, but this range is consistent with daytime temp advice from "Christian" (82°-90°F), "Angelofdeathzz" (80-85F) and Precarious (80-85F). Besides, I have my other group at 95-105F and they're doing just fine. I'll adjust as needed.

I soak the substrate in the enclosure about every other day, which puts RH at about 80% after soaking, and down to about 50% before I hit it again. I don't mist them anymore, although I have been looking at drip systems (none installed as yet).

The enclosures closer to the ceiling are warmer - in part because it's warmer near the ceiling, and because the lights from the cage below warm the bottom of the enclosure. They need drenching slightly more often.

I had an oddball idea (go figure, huh?) to put a small betta tank inside, with a wide mesh over it. Or a lid with a gap (to keep out feces and debris). Always thinking about a waterfall or other decorative AND practical element, but so far, it just presents more problems than it solves. Any other ideas? Small toads, maybe? I usually keep some odds and ends in there (some small mantids to feed off the extra flies, and provide some amusement).

 
Feeding / Molting Note:

I noticed a male was about to molt from L5-L6, so Ipulled him out and gave him his own net cube. Molted fine with nothing in the cube (just the mesh). I put a single annoying fly in there the next morning. No interest in eatting until almost excatly 48 hour after the molt. Just FYI.

 
Molting note:

I had a beautiful molt from L6 to L7, that defied the odds. Just moments after the legs extended, one very reckless L6 decided to crawl BETWEEN the shed legs! I watched in terror as he forced his way through the legs and out the other side. Whew. Nope. Wait for it... One more lap around the enclosure... and... THROUGH THE LEGS AGAIN!!! I have NO IDEA what possessed him! It's exactly the kind of thing MY BROTHER would do to me if I ever had to shed.

Despite the annoyance of his brother, the molt was fine. But it was pretty funny (looking back). A few minutes later, he stepped the rest of the way out of his skin, and just scowled at his little brother with utter contempt. Love to get a thought bubble over THAT guy's head...

 
Just another comment on the nylon rug liner that I'm using on the top. Here's a pic of a skin that has been hanging for about 4 days and has yet to fall. A record for my enclosures for sure. The one to the right has been up for 3 days and counting...

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Had reasonable success today with feeding crickets to L5-L8 Idolos (probably 1 in 8 went for it). Worse odds, but (possibly) better nutrition with superworms (about 1 in 10). The ones that DID go for it, greedily ate them entirely. We'll see if the same nymphs will go for it tomorrow. (Am I the only one having trouble calling these beasts "nymphs"?).

Here's a few pics...

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I couldn't get a good pic with my phone, but this is a compromise enclosure, where I added "sticks" to the enclosure (well, really plastic plants, but relatively thin, whispy branches). I'll watch how they do on it, then maybe thicken it up. They seem to like hanging from the leaves more than the branches. I may use similar branches in the final adult enclosure(s).

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Very nice, you've got all the bases covered that way (netting and sticks), maybe get the leaves and branches closer to the top with safety pins so they can grab on to do the flip?

I like it ! Hope you get some flies hatched soon...

 
Sporeworld said:
I couldn't get a good pic with my phone, but this is a compromise enclosure, where I added "sticks" to the enclosure (well, really plastic plants, but relatively thin, whispy branches). I'll watch how they do on it, then maybe thicken it up. They seem to like hanging from the leaves more than the branches. I may use similar branches in the final adult enclosure(s).
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Plastic branches will do you no good. They're not textured, so they're hard to grip. They can still climb them by wrapping their feet around but I doubt they will be of much help during a molt.

Just go into the wild (Eeek!) and get some plain old, brown twigs (Egad!!! Horror of horrors...). There is a whole big world outside of Michael's chock full of good materials better suited to your Idolo's needs. :p

But seriously, I want as many of your babies as possible to make the transition into healthy, well-formed adults. I'm not saying you won't get adults otherwise, as animals will do their best with what they're given. But why not give them the best chance at an easy transition?

 
Precarious said:
Plastic branches will do you no good. They're not textured, so they're hard to grip. They can still climb them by wrapping their feet around but I doubt they will be of much help during a molt.

Just go into the wild (Eeek!) and get some plain old, brown twigs (Egad!!! Horror of horrors...). There is a whole big world outside of Michael's chock full of good materials better suited to your Idolo's needs. :p

But seriously, I want as many of your babies as possible to make the transition into healthy, well-formed adults. I'm not saying you won't get adults otherwise, as animals will do their best with what they're given. But why not give them the best chance at an easy transition?
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Nice!

These branches are crazy-complex textured, with soft rubber-like plastic. So better than all but the crustiest twigs I could find. I did (and have fairly regularly) walked my neighborhood and park neurotically, breaking, collecting and touch-testing branches. If they SNAP in my fingers, they don't make the cut. I really like lilac (so, I think, does AngelofDeath), but it's hard to find out here in any quantity.

So, yeah, as much as I'm committed to this no-branch approached, I'm prepared to switch over immediately. After the first "wave" of sub/adult molts, I'll to the TwigCage as well, just to compare. I think my only real concern is them molting from the sides, but that hasn't happened yet, and I suspect it had more to do with overcrowding before. Now, it's 4 subs to a 30" wide tank, and seems comfortable. I have 4 individual ExoTerras built and standing by if needed.

Now we wait...

 
Sporeworld said:
So, yeah, as much as I'm committed to this no-branch approached, I'm prepared to switch over immediately. After the first "wave" of sub/adult molts, I'll to the TwigCage as well, just to compare.
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Glad to hear it. I think if you get a chance to watch the subadults molt firsthand you'll see just how difficult it is for such a large, heavy insect. If you think about it, what they do is really amazing. It's like child birth - only birthing themselves. The challenges inherent in the process are incredible so we've got to do anything we can to make sure they succeed.

Another thing to consider is that if you are around enough to watch for swollen wing buds you can have an enclosure on hand decked out specifically for molting. You can move potential molters into there and still have the others in whatever setup you prefer. The only real danger is during molt and right after. Once they get through it and the new skin hardens they can pretty much grip anything again. So, realistically, branches can be a temporary thing.

 
Well, I've got 3 Giant sub adult Females(L8), as Sporeworld mentioned to me, they seem much bigger than others I've had in the past, the shield at sub is as big as my adults last time around, and I also have 3 big sub males and a bunch of presub males that I've been slowing down. Using 4 tanks now for all the different stages, I'm a happy camper to say the least and have my finger's crossed for myself and all of you as well. Sports chant in order here "LET'S GO IDOLO" now that was almost as much fun as yelling it at a Red Wings game "Let's Go Red Wings", did I mention I live in HockeyTown, USA. :p

 
Precarious said:
Glad to hear it. I think if you get a chance to watch the subadults molt firsthand you'll see just how difficult it is for such a large, heavy insect....
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I'm not sure if you remember, but I've had adults before, and watched the whole (nerve-wracking) process. Also, I've got 8 subadults now, and I've seen almost all the moltings.

And yeah, you can tell when it's comming, but the females have that thing where they can delay for a really long time. So, I'm just leaving them in place for now, but solo molting chambers are ready and waiting...

 
The genitalia will show when a molt is coming too. The sexual organs will start to poke out of a subadult around the day before/of a molt. So you have swollen wing buds over a week in advance, protruding genitalia around 12 hours out, and raised wing buds in the minutes before the molt.

 
Sporeworld said:
Had reasonable success today with feeding crickets to L5-L8 Idolos (probably 1 in 8 went for it). Worse odds, but (possibly) better nutrition with superworms (about 1 in 10). The ones that DID go for it, greedily ate them entirely. We'll see if the same nymphs will go for it tomorrow.
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Something I had a lot of success with when trying to get mantids to take to mealworms was cutting off an end and placing that open end against the mantis's mouth. The species I have experience doing that with(G. gonylodes & couple CA native sp.) would generally start eating as soon as something contacted their mouth and then grab on to it and chow down.

This might work to get your idolos to take more readily to other feeders?

 
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What said:
Something I had a lot of success with when trying to get mantids to take to mealworms was cutting off an end and placing that open end against the mantis's mouth. The species I have experience doing that with(G. gonylodes & couple CA native sp.) would generally start eating as soon as something contacted their mouth and then grab on to it and chow down.

This might work to get your idolos to take more readily to other feeders?
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Yup! I did this with crickets, too. Also, a slight glaze of honey on the tip seems to help, as does just wetting them down.

What I found was fighting me, was the hard shell of the super worm. You could hear the claws hit it, and they'd freak a bit and let it go. If I was less squeamish, i'd cut them lengthwise. I've fed them BB grubs without incident.

 
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