Mantid Cabinet / Enclosures

[Rick]

Ah so the Vaseline and tape aren't looking so good. The tape is tempting and would seem plausible if it's done **very** carefully leaving absolutely no sticky-side facing up and no air bubbles so that it would never come undone. Checking the tape on a routine basis would be required as well. It also eliminates the problem of the mantids dragging Vaseline throughout the enclosure.Can't really stop them from climbing up. Well, you are probably correct and really, the solution is easy. Get the lights off of the top of the enclosure.

So to recap:

1. Mantids hanging on the roof - Impossible to stop, no solution, they MUST be allowed to dangle from the screen regardless of plant life available and no matter how precisely/carefully placed the tape is, they will get stuck in it. Vaseline could be toxic, will get dragged around the enclosure and could interfere with molting.

Solution - Raise the lights off of the top of the enclosure and let them dingleberry up there.

2. Money - It's unnecessary, you can save a lot of money, it's not as portable and the Exo-Terra 12x12x12 is not really a good idea for Mantids

Solution - I'm okay with the money and the enclosures can be split into 2 smaller enclosures and only the biggest of my collection go in here, the rest will be placed on the right-hand side of the cabinet.

3. Cabinet might not have enough air flow

Solution - Install computer fans and route them to a power source (AC Adap or PC PS)

Okay so with all the warnings and "dont do it" advice. I'm not going to buy the 6 Exo-Terra enclosures. I'm going to buy just 1 enclosure and see how well it works (or does not). That will reduce the cost of this thing *significantly* and is just.. a smart idea since I don't really know how well they will work. (or not).

Cost:

Cabinet - Estimated $100-$125

(1) Exo Terra 12x12x12 $45

(1) Exo Terra Compact Light fixture $15

(1) LCD Thermometer $5

$165-$190. That's a very rough estimate and it doesn't include anything that goes into the enclosure.

I don't know if the vaseline would be toxic however it is sticky and just won't work. Lights are not what makes mantids go to the top, they just like to spend much of their time as high up as they can get. There really is no way around that. Good luck.

 

[revmdn]

This is just my opinion, but I would put the smaller adult mantids in 32 oz deli cups, the larger species in 2.5 gallon tanks. Spend the money on a nice shelving unit or units. Air flow is important (orchids), but I don't think you need fans for each container. Maybe one for the room. And I think Phil mentioned the tape in regards to some roach species, but others can walk up smooth surfaces. Mantids can climb up almost all surfaces. So the risk is not worth it, and I don't think it would work. Sometimes the simplest ideas are the best, although I like your attitude. B)

 

[lectricblueyes]

This is just my opinion, but I would put the smaller adult mantids in 32 oz deli cups, the larger species in 2.5 gallon tanks. Spend the money on a nice shelving unit or units. Air flow is important (orchids), but I don't think you need fans for each container. Maybe one for the room. And I think Phil mentioned the tape in regards to some roach species, but others can walk up smooth surfaces. Mantids can climb up almost all surfaces. So the risk is not worth it, and I don't think it would work. Sometimes the simplest ideas are the best, although I like your attitude. B)

Yep, agree on the smaller adults. Definitely a good idea I'm keeping the right side of the cabinet wide open with adjustable shelves for just that reason.

Airflow is for the enclosures mostly because they won't have a whole ton of space between the top lid and the roof of the cabinet.

Awww.. buy shelves? That's no fun! Father/Son time would be totally restricted since furniture purchasing is my mother's forte!

I am definitely posting all of this for advice/criticism so... keep it coming. Don't be shy.

Thanks for the compliment on my attitude I feel a bit defeated in my fancy pants/over priced setup but I'm gonna keep trucking.

 

[lectricblueyes]

Anyone willing to experiment a bit? Try putting up that super-slick clear shipping tape to see if an adult can climb on it? I probably don't need to say this but if you DO want to give it a shot, FEEL THE TAPE WITH YOUR FINGER to be SURE there is no sticky side up!!! Thanks!

 

[Swipht]

I see where he's coming from. Putting many cups on the right to hatch ooths in, as well as keeping individual mantis until they grow to a size that would be better suited for the larger tarrariums.

As far as opening the front of the tarrarium and letting the feeders escape, what if you put the sleves on tracks like your draws in the kitchen, so you can slide the tanks out, and open it from the top? That way you wont run the risk of any non flying food from escaping. Might be easier then trying to drill holes in the glass, and run the risk of cracking it. Then again I don't really find press board easy to drill into... Hate the stuff myself. Used to have a wood shop in my garrage as a kid: so I can see how working with wood would be a great time, especialy having a beer with your dad while doing it. You should becareful that the shelves wont slide off the tracks and fall out, breaking your tarrarium.... You might not think $46 dollars is a lot, but cleaning up the mess would be a pain. Maybe also make a lip to catch the tarrarium if you should pull it out to fast and it wants to slide forward.

If you don't want to go the route of building sliding shelves then you could always just use foreseps to 'hand' feed your mantis. Then again you really can't force them to eat, since they do have the habbit of not eating before they molt, or lay ooths. So just offer it to them, and if they don't take it just put it back, and offer it to them again later that day, or the next day. Cut back on escapees, as well makes it easier for the mantis to find food in a 'larger' encloser.

 

[bassist]

Anyone willing to experiment a bit? Try putting up that super-slick clear shipping tape to see if an adult can climb on it? I probably don't need to say this but if you DO want to give it a shot, FEEL THE TAPE WITH YOUR FINGER to be SURE there is no sticky side up!!! Thanks!

Not going to stop them from getting up if they want to they'll just fly/jump, getting to the top is unavoidable Lol.

 

[Rick]

Mantids can climb about anything and if they couldn't get to the top they will likely keep on trying. Don't feel bad. Most newcomers to this hobby want fancy cages at first but soon realize simple is better.

 

[lectricblueyes]

Mantids can climb about anything and if they couldn't get to the top they will likely keep on trying. Don't feel bad. Most newcomers to this hobby want fancy cages at first but soon realize simple is better.

Like your signature says...

Yours truly,

Stupid

 

[PhilinYuma]

Like your signature says...Yours truly,

Stupid

No, stupid you're not, you're just close enough to being a Chicagoan to want to things BIG. Your project also seems to have captured everyone's interest

I'm still very new at this, less than six months (it just feels like six years) and my setup is relatively small, 40 32 oz pots and some larger containers for breeding, larger species etc. Since, like you, I live alone, except for Faithful Hound, I can do what I like, and my bedroom is now effectively the bug room. With ooths, new hatchlings, nymphs, adults and courting couples, it takes a fair bit of work (but FUN work!) to keep it manageable. This weekend, ten surviving GiantAsian nymphs will go into pots as potentil breeding stock, and early next week, I shall get ten of Don L's new babies, so that is 20 more puts and two more shelves. I shall also get an adult ghost and a bunch of new ooths next week. The point is that you are probably going to do the same, and it will be hard to manage your "growth spurts" in yr beautiful, proposed setups.

Here is something you might want to consider. Build your cabinet, but leave it open and somewhere where it can be seen and show off your adult specimens. You can solve the the ceiling problem by putting in a false one, and you'll work out the other issues.

I guess at your age you don't want to turn your bedroom into a workroom :lol: but it would be good to have a room like that (and a box with 100 pots and lids) to manage your day-to-day husbandry and house all those sweater boxes full of crix and roaches. It would be really great if you could find someone in your area with a setup, but there are always folks in this forum to talk to.

And, if you work hard, you should have your work room running and all your enclosures on display when you hold a big party to celebrate the Cubs winning the World Series this year!!

 

[Katnapper]

No, stupid you're not.

I agree! You just haven't gained experience yet, and are funny to boot... anyone who can make Rick laugh has to be funny. (And he likely laughed at your signature!)

I guess at your age you don't want to turn your bedroom into a workroom :lol: but it would be good to have a room like that

Yes, turning your bedroom into a "bug room" might have negative effects on your social life. But hopefully you either have an alternate workable space in your apartment... or a girlfriend/s that won't run away screaming in horror just when the mood gets good! :lol:

 

[Rick]

I love his idea. The original plans would make a great enlcosure for some other creature. Just gonna need some modifications for mantids. I really like the 2 1/2 gallon mini aquariums I mentioned. For awhile there I would buy those little potted indoor plants and put them in there pot and all. They made it look pretty nice. Another thing I don't like about mantids is with misting it tends to dirty up the glass pretty fast not to mention all the mantis poop. I always end up back at the 32 oz deli cup. <_<

 

[tonyi]

LectricBlueyes;

I fully understand the desire to have a nice planted vivarium set up. It is a bit of different mindset, a well-functioning planted vivarium requires a holistic approach, i.e. it's not a cage for a mantis but an attempt to maintain a limited miniature eco-system. The mantis/mantids are just one of many organisms in such an enclosure. This requires some planning in terms of substrate, lighting, moisture/climate control and it also benefits from an established population of invertebrates (springtails and isopods do the dirty work). It's a very rewarding experience to maintain a whole system like that and not particularly work-intensive once the planning and construction work is finished.

That said, I've come to understand that an enclosure like that is not better than a more easy solution when it comes to rearing mantids. However, I still intend to try it once my orchid mantis has grown larger. Feeding ports and fly-proofing are easily taken care of with a little DIY spirit (I already have taken care of both in my Exo Terra).

I've attached a pic of my own Exo Terra vivarium to give you an idea of how it can look. The water feature has been removed after the pic was taken though, I've used that space for experiments with non-organic substrates instead.

 

[Rick]

LectricBlueyes;I fully understand the desire to have a nice planted vivarium set up. It is a bit of different mindset, a well-functioning planted vivarium requires a holistic approach, i.e. it's not a cage for a mantis but an attempt to maintain a limited miniature eco-system. The mantis/mantids are just one of many organisms in such an enclosure. This requires some planning in terms of substrate, lighting, moisture/climate control and it also benefits from an established population of invertebrates (springtails and isopods do the dirty work). It's a very rewarding experience to maintain a whole system like that and not particularly work-intensive once the planning and construction work is finished.

That said, I've come to understand that an enclosure like that is not better than a more easy solution when it comes to rearing mantids. However, I still intend to try it once my orchid mantis has grown larger. Feeding ports and fly-proofing are easily taken care of with a little DIY spirit (I already have taken care of both in my Exo Terra).

I've attached a pic of my own Exo Terra vivarium to give you an idea of how it can look. The water feature has been removed after the pic was taken though, I've used that space for experiments with non-organic substrates instead.

Wow that is beautiful Tony! I think if you have something like that a mantis can live just fine in it. However for most of us with multiple mantids and breeding going on the simple approach is better.

 

[tonyi]

Wow that is beautiful Tony! I think if you have something like that a mantis can live just fine in it. However for most of us with multiple mantids and breeding going on the simple approach is better.

Thanks Rick! I agree with your assessment, I just wanted to mention that a tropical vivarium can be an end in itself rather than "just" an enclosure for a specific mantid or herp. Right now I'm keeping my orchid mantis in a 32oz container placed inside the vivarium (the idea being that she can get accustomed to and benefit from the climate and lighting until she gets big enough to roam around freely).

 

[lectricblueyes]

LectricBlueyes;I fully understand the desire to have a nice planted vivarium set up. It is a bit of different mindset, a well-functioning planted vivarium requires a holistic approach, i.e. it's not a cage for a mantis but an attempt to maintain a limited miniature eco-system. The mantis/mantids are just one of many organisms in such an enclosure. This requires some planning in terms of substrate, lighting, moisture/climate control and it also benefits from an established population of invertebrates (springtails and isopods do the dirty work). It's a very rewarding experience to maintain a whole system like that and not particularly work-intensive once the planning and construction work is finished.

That said, I've come to understand that an enclosure like that is not better than a more easy solution when it comes to rearing mantids. However, I still intend to try it once my orchid mantis has grown larger. Feeding ports and fly-proofing are easily taken care of with a little DIY spirit (I already have taken care of both in my Exo Terra).

I've attached a pic of my own Exo Terra vivarium to give you an idea of how it can look. The water feature has been removed after the pic was taken though, I've used that space for experiments with non-organic substrates instead.

Wow! Tony, that is amazing. That is far more advanced than what I have in mind for now. I do want to reach that level of beauty/expertise/detail one day.

 

[The_Asa]

I also like the idea. If you really want to get into this hobby by way of obtaining many mantids, this is going to be outdated in time however. With a select few it really shouldn't be as much of a problem. A couple kinks worked out and this should be at the very least functional as well as aesthetic.

 

[lectricblueyes]

UPDATE

Work is moving forward. As you can see I'll be updating my original post (thread starter) with news and photos.

 

[hibiscusmile]

Hey lectric, no vaseline, use earwax! :lol: any kind of oil and petroleum will end up killing the mantis and feeders, so lets move on...

What is the main reason for the kind of setup u r trying to make? if u r worried about the light on top, it can go on the side, or lower a screen which would be great for them to hang on and if u use fiberglass it wont absorbe the heat like wire will. I dont think it is advisable to stop them from hanging, the reason I say this is for their well being. If you came homefrom work and the couch and chair u usually hang around on was gone, u would have to sit somewhere else and as such u would be uncomfortable, and as such it would probably generally aggitate u as time when on, I mean sitting in a straight back chair, which u had to get from the kitchen :lol: is no wheres near as comfortable as that worn in couch or your easy chair... and it could cause them to be really uncomfortable too, like some of my dead leafs like to grab the guy next to them and use him as a branch, now the tough guy seems to like this, but the branch guy, well lets just say he is not a happy branch! :lol:

 

[Rick]

Hey lectric, no vaseline, use earwax! :lol: any kind of oil and petroleum will end up killing the mantis and feeders, so lets move on...What is the main reason for the kind of setup u r trying to make? if u r worried about the light on top, it can go on the side, or lower a screen which would be great for them to hang on and if u use fiberglass it wont absorbe the heat like wire will. I dont think it is advisable to stop them from hanging, the reason I say this is for their well being. If you came homefrom work and the couch and chair u usually hang around on was gone, u would have to sit somewhere else and as such u would be uncomfortable, and as such it would probably generally aggitate u as time when on, I mean sitting in a straight back chair, which u had to get from the kitchen :lol: is no wheres near as comfortable as that worn in couch or your easy chair... and it could cause them to be really uncomfortable too, like some of my dead leafs like to grab the guy next to them and use him as a branch, now the tough guy seems to like this, but the branch guy, well lets just say he is not a happy branch! :lol:

Agree with everything except earwax. Mantids will want to use the lid most of the time so do not deny that option.

It's looking good. How do you get those tanks so cheap?

 

[lectricblueyes]

Hey lectric, no vaseline, use earwax! :lol: any kind of oil and petroleum will end up killing the mantis and feeders, so lets move on...What is the main reason for the kind of setup u r trying to make? if u r worried about the light on top, it can go on the side, or lower a screen which would be great for them to hang on and if u use fiberglass it wont absorbe the heat like wire will. I dont think it is advisable to stop them from hanging, the reason I say this is for their well being. If you came homefrom work and the couch and chair u usually hang around on was gone, u would have to sit somewhere else and as such u would be uncomfortable, and as such it would probably generally aggitate u as time when on, I mean sitting in a straight back chair, which u had to get from the kitchen :lol: is no wheres near as comfortable as that worn in couch or your easy chair... and it could cause them to be really uncomfortable too, like some of my dead leafs like to grab the guy next to them and use him as a branch, now the tough guy seems to like this, but the branch guy, well lets just say he is not a happy branch! :lol:

Yep, I've done away with keeping them off the ceiling. This is why I've re-done my plans and have made more room between the top of the enclosure, and the lights. (Don't want them getting too hot!). I'll be using the lowest wattage possible.