Mantis emotions

[anthony2001a]

Well, having talked about mantis intelligence, I'd like to bring up the idea of mantis emotions. Or more specifically, mantis behaviors that seem to show a rudimentary level of emotions. For example:

1) Excitement--I have seen mantids notice a prey animal and begin to open their mandibles and appear to "chew" in apparent anticipation of catching their prey. It's akin to a human's mouth watering in anticipation of a steak dinner.

2) Alertness--When a mantis spots a prey animal, it will suddenly go on alert, freezing and devoting full attention to the prey animal. Antennae will cease waving randomly and begin pointing towards the prey animal.

3) Pleasure--When consuming their prey, I've seen mantids happily swaying back and forth as they eat. Clearly, the action of eating offers some sort of reward for mantids, much as it does for humans. I would equate this swaying with a kind of pleasure being experienced.

4) Frustration/annoyance/anger--when various prey animals like fruitflies crawl onto a mantis, I've seen them swat the offending animal away and sometime the mantis will relocate to get to an area where it won't be walked on. It's like the mantis is annoyed at being bothered. I've seen mantids appear to be angry/frustrated by cages/clear plastic/glass where they bang against it and don't seem to understand why they can't get through it.

Obviously, I haven't seen things like sadness or empathy, which would be difficult to infer from mantid behaviors. Nevertheless, rudimentary emotions would certainly offer an advantage to a mantis, allowing it to be a more successful predator and encouraging it to catch prey to feed those emotions.

Anthony

 

[OGIGA]

Great observations! I notice the same things too.

 

[Rick]

I disagree on mantids having emotions. Most of these are just responses to the environment with many being instinct. Most animals do those things. I believe the swaying is to make the mantis appear to be a leaf or twig blowing in the wind. Part of camouflage.

Excitement: all animals get excited over food.

Alertness: When a mantis sees prey it must give it full attention and track it in order to catch it. If it doesn't eat it will die, therefore it must give food it's full attention.

Pleasureoubt insects experience any type of pleasure.

Frustration: Swatting or jerking is just a response to the feeling of something crawling on the mantis. I doubt they get frustrated.

 

[AFK]

i disagree. emotions aren't what drives a mantis to survive. it's instinct.

alertness - it's not an emotion. it's a heightened state of awareness.

pleasure - these mantises sway probably because during eating, the mantis is more focused on its food so to compensate during this period of vulnerability, the mantis sways to mimick swaying branches and leaves. the swaying blends the eating motions in.

frustration/anger/annoyance - it's much more likely that the mantis is just instinctively relocating or swatting. there is no reason to think there is emotion evolved. when a roomba moves to another location for more dirt to suck up, is it because it is feeling emotions?

from a logical point of view, correlation alone does NOT imply causation. cum hoc ergo propter hoc.

 

[OGIGA]

Probably "emotion" isn't the best word to describe the phenomenons. However, I don't know how to prove to disprove whether or not mantises experience emotions. By the way, why don't we also figure out a precise definition of "emotion" before saying too much more?

 

[AFK]

all living things by default act by instinct/reflex. unless given evidence, there is no reason to assume the affirmative (that there is something non-default, e.g. emotion).

 

[OGIGA]

Most of the plants I've seen don't seem to have reflexes. Some micro-organisms don't move on their own either.

 

[AFK]

no, they do have reflexes. when water comes in contact with roots, the roots by reflex absorb the water. the plants also convert sunlight into food when sunlight reaches the leaves and the leaves by reflex start photosynthesis. the same with micro-organisms - their bodily processes are done reflexively.

and even if that weren't true, you knew what my point is (and it also won't change the fact that my point is still true), regardless of whether all living things have reflexes.

 

[skinnylegs]

as oposed to plesure,when eating i have also noticed my mantids abdomen moving in and out more rapidly,but thats probably just digestion.

 

[randyardvark]

abdomen movement is to do with breathing, the air tubes that invertebrates use to breath (tracholoes i think) are located up the side of the abdoman, and the pumping motion causes oxygen inriched air to come into coantact with a kind of fluid which is then absorbed into the insects system, abdomon pumping is just their version of a dogs panting, i may be a bit iffy with the details, as i havnt done biology for a year but thats about it (dont forget hunting is a stenuous activity for a mantis)

im sure some one will care to elaborate...

 

[Rick]

abdomen movement is to do with breathing, the air tubes that invertebrates use to breath (tracholoes i think) are located up the side of the abdoman, and the pumping motion causes oxygen inriched air to come into coantact with a kind of fluid which is then absorbed into the insects system, abdomon pumping is just their version of a dogs panting, i may be a bit iffy with the details, as i havnt done biology for a year but thats about it (dont forget hunting is a stenuous activity for a mantis)im sure some one will care to elaborate...

yep

 

[sean]

that is correct. insects have tubes all over their body through which oxygen diffuses. they are called spiracles. by pumping their abdomen.. they expel used air so the spiracles are low in oxgen, this increases the rate of diffusion so that more oxygen can be obtained at the time of feeding, which is a heightened time of activity for mantids.

as for mantid emotions... i dont think they have them... after all they are insects. they have behaviours that react to the environment to help them survive... e.g.swaying to help blend in, in vulnerable situations and reactive instincts when hunting. this runs true with the intelligence debate.

i must also raise the issue that people are misunderstanding their mantids behaviour because they are their pets. they WANT them to be intelligent and have emotions. mantids are intelligent because they are predators... all predators need greater brain function to outwit prey, but they arnt intelligent to the degree that they would recognise you. mantids can turn their heads, like no other insect, which makes us relate to them. but they are just an insect.... they have instincts to help them survive and reproduce... thats all.

 

[bubforever]

I don't know it's hard to tell. We can just ask it if it has any feelings, but we can't just assume that it doesn't. Though a lot of these emotions explained do seem plausable, it's more likely that they are more instinct than emotion.

 

[sean]

i think its all instinct. all of these 'mantid emotions' can be explained in instinct terms.

 

[OGIGA]

Now we really need to define instinct and emotion. I think AFK's definition of instinct is way too broad. I would opt that instinct has to do with some kind of nervous system. Otherwise, paper towels have instincts too. And would we argue that electronics (like a calculator) have instincts too?

 

[bubforever]

Still emotion can be mixed with instinct.

 

[sean]

i would define instinct as an inbuilt guide on how to survive. reflex to a stimulus plays a great part. they can be insticntive or conditioned (learnt). an example of an automatic response would be flinching away from something that is causing pain. an example of a conditioned response would be a mantis recognising a paticular food item as food and say a finger tip as a threat and not food. an example of inbuilt instinct would be swaying. (a nymph knows to sway without being taught to do it). the question i would raise would be what is the evolutionary value of emotions in a mantis? my response would be there is none.

they have feelings yes, (they feel pain,hot,cold,hunger etc), but no emotions... they dont feel sad.. or fall in love... lol.

 

[OGIGA]

Not that I believe that evolution actually happened (but let's not have a debate about that here), but what is the evolutionary value of emotions in anything? I can only imagine that emotions will hinder the survival of the fittest.

The swaying motion is still fascinating. Yes, people keep saying that they sway so that they blend into the leaves in the wind. But I don't think that mantises go, "Hey look, the leaves are moving so I will too." I know that because none of my mantises have been outside and they all sway.

Anyway, why do they sway? Do they move using a heart rather than muscles (like a spider) so that when they're excited their heart is more active?

 

[bubforever]

Just as an example. Fear is an emotion, when your scared your instinct tells you to run away, i have seen this in my mantis. Though i'm sure your right about the love or sadness.