Eoullis
Active member
I guess because arse just sounds funny to me and slightly less offensive to the more sensitive and up-tight folks.And a question for you. Why do you write "arse" with the English spelling?
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U.S. Mantis Permit info
- Thread starter Jay
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The US goverment tends to create blanket bans because they are esier to make and renforce. They then squander the money that they saved on Iraq. It is now illegal to keep snakehead fish despite the fact only a few species are invasive.
That is because the thread is over two years old. Please introduce yourself in the introductions forum. Thanks.the link isn't working
Colorcham427
Well-known member
Are idolomantises endangered?
how the heck do people sell them online in an open webpage to people across the us? , how do you do that???
how the heck do people sell them online in an open webpage to people across the us? , how do you do that???
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Because mantids are a gray area as has been discussed.Are idolomantises endangered?
how the heck do people sell them online in an open webpage to people across the us?, how do you do that???
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Colorcham427
Well-known member
So my friend has been talking back and fourth to the broker at the airport. The broker is the man who has the box under his supervision as far as my friend knows.
No matter how many times he asks the broker who he could talk to, to educate them, he continues to say "there won't be a deal where you could keep them." My friend wants to explain that the species is harmless and would never survive the new jersey climate, nor are they fast moving, so they are easy to watch over.
My friend believes that no matter what he says, they will either kill them because the broker told him that somebody else who had the same stuff shipped to them someplace in New York, got them ID'd and they were destroyed, NOT sent back to dealer in Tanzania.
My friends really upset, he doesn't want them to be murdered. He even asked the broker if he could find it in his heart to find a zoo or even the Liberty Science Museum to take them and try to work with them... Liberty science center has lots of stick bugs there and other large insects.
My friend is worrying about why the Fish and Game or even the USDA need to know the info. about the package. The broker asked my friend to tell them once they contact him, the genus, amount inside of package, value, etc.
My friend just wants this to be ended, wish he could just convince them that they're are not going to get out of a taped up box, and just ship them back to where they came from.
My friend's dealer exporter, didn't charge him anything, promising him that the oothecae are good and will hatch. My friend didn't pay for shipping neither which is good. But the dealer wrote on the package Live Oothecae. I have a feeling this exporter does not know that he needs a permit to do this.
I called a few of the fish and game and the usda gov. people myself, and asked them what mantid species can be imported to the states and they all said none of them. They said the USA have a couple species, why not just keep those as pets. They obviously have no idea how beautiful most out of state species are!!
I'll keep you guys posted about my friend's situation.
My friend is thinking about starting some sort of insect museum, maybe then, he will be able top obtain a license and keep some exotic insects. He needs to start doing lots of research. Contacting the right people too. Hope I can help him.
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not a very good idea to even mentioning about this to those kind of agencies as they may add 2 and 2 together and figure if you have the illegal species and demand where you obtained them or fine you outright and what not!
:blink:
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Colorcham427
Well-known member
I don't have any mantids any longer, as soon as I found out they are illegal I told my parents and they FORCED me to destroy them...
I literally cried, takes a lot for me to cry...
Colorcham427
Well-known member
Paul, my friend mentioned them because he wants to know how he could go about doing this the LEGAL WAY, so no person can fine him nor take them away since he would have a permit...
But apparently it isn't possible unless you are one of those three special things... Zoo guy, science museum etc. buildings or a Professor working at a University doing studies.
We've been through this a few times. Everybody thinks they're going to get new information by making some calls but it isn't going to happen.
ismart
Well-known member
No way! :blink: Please tell me you are joking?I don't have any mantids any longer, as soon as I found out they are illegal I told my parents and they FORCED me to destroy them...
As Rick has mentioned countless of times. If you are not a Zoo, Museum, Professor/University, or Scientist. Your chances of getting a permit are slim at best. If by some miraculous way you obtain a permit. You will be letting the man in your life. What this means is random checks on what you have. They will come to your house to make sure you are not doing anything illegal. Lucky for us, APHIS has bigger fish to fry. Let us not ask stupid questions like ''is it okay for me to let free exotic mantids in my yard?'' Use common sense! Of course it is not okay!
Unfortunately Brian your friends mantids, and ooths will be destroyed! No matter what your friend tells them. If he is not an entomologist he is not worth being heard. Please let us know how all this pans out?
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PhilinYuma
Well-known member
Your poor friend, Brian! Aside from the unfortunate business with the Fed, am I right in thinking that yr friend has no tracking number and no evidence aside from the "agent" that any package actually exists? Have you been able to make an independent check of the agent? Had your friend thought that this might be a means of sending him nothing and pocketing his fee? No one puts "live ooths" on a package more than once. Was this his/her first deal?
Generally speaking, it is best to avoid Tanzanian insect dealers and Nigerian princes.
Generally speaking, it is best to avoid Tanzanian insect dealers and Nigerian princes.
Colorcham427
Well-known member
Apparently Mohamed is a f'ing moron and writes live ootheca on all of his packages. Its not the first time I heard of him being a total dumb a$$.
Yeah I don't keep any mantids and I killed them all... lol
Yeah I don't keep any mantids and I killed them all... lol
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Colorcham427
Well-known member
I just cannot stand how they would allow people to import big spiders. I love tarantulas don't get me wrong, but ###### would be better at surviving? A spider or mantis if it escaped?
All mantid species are a billion times slower than most spiders.
All I can do is laugh and say wow... F'ing morons. Mantids are so cool and they have no idea how easy they are to keep in a cage!
All mantid species are a billion times slower than most spiders.
All I can do is laugh and say wow... F'ing morons. Mantids are so cool and they have no idea how easy they are to keep in a cage!
PhilinYuma
Well-known member
Well, I guess that you're a sadder but a wiser man!
Schloaty
Well-known member
Come on people! Ever hear of a "greaced palm?"
Yeah - and let me know how that works out for ya.
"If you are not a Zoo, Museum, Professor/University, or Scientist. Your chances of getting a permit are slim at best. "
But if you are one of those things. Say, a scientist and professor who want to do research on the effects of different diets on an as yet unimported species.
Does anyone know what your actual set up has to be to make APHIS happy? I've heard the "two closed doors" rule. Anyone know anything else?
Does it matter if the Professor in question recently publicly ripped APHIS a new one?
But if you are one of those things. Say, a scientist and professor who want to do research on the effects of different diets on an as yet unimported species.
Does anyone know what your actual set up has to be to make APHIS happy? I've heard the "two closed doors" rule. Anyone know anything else?
Does it matter if the Professor in question recently publicly ripped APHIS a new one?
PhilinYuma
Well-known member
Peter, i hope that I am wrong about this, but I suspect that it takes more than being a biology (entomology?) professor to get APHIS approval. If the university does not have an established mantis lab and ongoing mantis research, I think that it would take more than a wish to study "effects of different diets on an as yet unimported species" (why?) to convince APHIS, like a research grant. University professors are well known for their probity ( ), but APHIS might smell a rat and would certainly be checking up on the project as they do with all approved facilities. If they did approve such a plan, though, I am sure that they would let you know the conditions under which they must be kept, so that they can blame you if anything goes wrong.
This is a "in my opinion" post, so not very valuable. In your position, I would check out Prete's book, which lists all of the contributors and the universities where they were working when the book came out. Contact one or two of them and get expert advice.
), but APHIS might smell a rat and would certainly be checking up on the project as they do with all approved facilities. If they did approve such a plan, though, I am sure that they would let you know the conditions under which they must be kept, so that they can blame you if anything goes wrong.This is a "in my opinion" post, so not very valuable. In your position, I would check out Prete's book, which lists all of the contributors and the universities where they were working when the book came out. Contact one or two of them and get expert advice.
