Idolomantis Consolidated

Psychobunny said:

Do you buy the ZooMed vines or some other brand?

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I buy a coil of vines at A.C.Moore for about $7 that is good for many enclosures. Cut it to length and shape appropriately. They grip the leaves more than the plastic stem. I use it in all my enclosures and many deli cups. Use safety pins to secure to the sides of net cages.

warpdrive said:

I agree. Only ghosts are as communal. I've had zero cannibalism in small net cages and exoterras.

Yet even with great humidity I've had my fourth mismolt yesterday. Today, I got my first good L6 with poorer humidity then yesterday.

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xxFaultxx said:

But Ive been keeping my Idolos with some high humidity...about 70% ...I spray the exo terra about 3-4 times to keep the substrate moist...No mis-molts yet ( crosses fingers ) ...and for my sub female...I want to make sure she has plenty of humidity so that she doesnt mis-molt...But 7 Idolos...no mis-molts yet...I hope to beat the 50%-ish adulthood for Idolos

Not to go off topic a little but ive never had any ghost cannibalism untill my new set of nymphs I got which are now L4, but one female ate 3 ghosts in 1 day!!!!!!! right after eating 3 house flies as an L3!! I was slighty mad LoL

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I think some overlook the importance of giving them a chance to drink on a regular basis. Humidity could be 100% but if they are lacking fluid in their body they will still mismolt. On the other hand if they get to drink regularly they have much better tolerance for drops in humidity.

I mist mine directly every day, sometimes twice. I can honestly tell you that I have NEVER had a bad molt relating to moisture. The only bad molts I've had were the mantis choosing to molt from a low perch or falling for one reason or another. You will see some L2-L3 get stuck in skin no matter the humidity level. That's more to do with nature weeding out individual weakness.

Also, Ghosts are relatively communal but once females reach pre-sub they should be separated. You rarely see cannibalism before that. Same goes for Unicorns and Oxyopsis gracilis. And you really have to keep up on feeding with any communal group. That girl must have been very hungry to fit 3 siblings and 3 house flies in her belly. I know it's tough to gauge how much they can handle so always feed extra just to be safe. Personally after a molt I feed mine until they stop eating. That way you can see how their abdomen looks at full extension and feed smaller maintenance meals from that point on.

If I don't mist at least once a day to drink(sometimes 2-3) I expect fail with these, they always are drinking the water from their raptors daily when misted, day after day. It's as important as high RH...

Yeah, mine always cleaned themselves after being sprays, but I was never sure how much really got ingested. I suspect properly feeding/watering the flies (or whatever prey) was even more important. I always "felt good" when they'd eat a juicy moth or katydid in addition to the flies. Soooo not scientific, but SEEMED better.

I think I had something like ten or more L4's (or around there) is my enclosure (below). Pay no attention to that numbers on the tape.



After that, I'd try to keep it to about 5 or 6. By adult, maybe less. You can see, they take up a lot of room, but are very tolerant of each other - maybe even a little gregarious.



Eventually, once they were adult, and there was no more risk of molting disasters, I let them roam around in those ginormous Net Castle things. Clearly (pun intended) not as good for viewing... but more practical. And, I thought, more bug-friendly. They really seemed to "enjoy" the space.

Okay guys, taking all your advise to heart, I started my mods with my 12 X 12 X 12 Exo.

Here are a few pics, not very good ones, but just to give U an idea and maybe you can give me your

comments.

As my population grows, I will mod my largest 18 X 18 X 23 Exo.

They are moving around with very well on all surfaces:

Psychobunny said:

Okay guys, taking all your advise to heart, I started my mods with my 12 X 12 X 12 Exo.

Here are a few pics, not very good ones, but just to give U an idea and maybe you can give me your

comments.

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I would have went with much thinner branches. They do best on branches they can wrap their feet around. Not sure how they will do with these for later molts. You may also get frustrated that the flies get above the top branches.

U mean those fat sticks on the lower level?

I can easily replace them with smaller ones, or eliminate completly if U think it's not needed.

Psychobunny said:

U mean those fat sticks on the lower level?

I can easily replace them with smaller ones, or eliminate completly if U think it's not needed.

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The twigs on the top of the cage are too big. They will have trouble moulting from them.

Psychobunny said:

Cool, what model of terrarium is that? I love the slidding front doors!!

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They are custom built for a pet shop down the road from me. A stock item, now. They run about $80 new. And, yeah - the sliding (and removable) doors are awesome! To do it over again, I'd put a false bottom, and maybe a wide gauge screen on the bottom as well. My metal cages have that, and it so much easier to keep clean without major disturbances.

Precarious said:

I would have went with much thinner branches. They do best on branches they can wrap their feet around. Not sure how they will do with these for later molts. You may also get frustrated that the flies get above the top branches.

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+1. Except for the fly part. I actually began to appreciate the flies clustering at the top. They were less annoying to the mantids, and when I sprayed the top, they all fluttered away to their imminent demise.

And, as long as you have reasonably soft substrate, you can probably ditch all but the top branches. They can climb the walls if they need to get back up.

hey, are these enough sticks for the lid of my future idolo's cage?

this is the lid with sticks glued to it

agent A said:

hey, are these enough sticks for the lid of my future idolo's cage?

this is the lid with sticks glued to it

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They aren't chimpanzees! :huh: You see the size of their little feet?

All you need is a row of thin branches. That's it. A pile like this will just give the flies places to hide and the Idolo will try to squeeze into the spaces.

Some photos of what I build last year in the links below. I do things a little differently now but should give you an idea of what you need.

New Idolo Tank

Terrarium with lots of twigs

Enclosures and Housing: The Basics

They aren't chimpanzees! :huh: You see the size of their little feet?

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Lol, chimpanzees, that was funny!

They need straw sized or smaller like this(below) with room to still grab flies, but not to much room or they will molt from the screen. Some will molt lower if you give them vertical branches, so others don't mess with them mid-molt, the smart ones do go down lower to molt, but you can't set it up where they molt to close to the bottom they need 6-8 inch clearence on that.

I used the thin BioVines on an earlier version. I also bought, but put into use, a can of PlastiDip, The idea was to use coat hangers made into a perfect shape, then dip/spray them with the rubbery material. Then I realized I could just use any grill like structure I could find to the same effect. And then I realized I was just making the equivalent of Carpet Liner, so I just started using that.

agent A said:

would raffia straw work?

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Yes, but it tends to rot and/or grow mold in a high humidity environment.

Precarious said:

Yes, but it tends to rot and/or grow mold in a high humidity environment.

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Again, +1

All my stuff is non-organic. Mold/Mildew can still be an issue, but is easily removed. You next investment should be in a quality nozzle for your garden hose... Makes cleaning a lot easier.

agent A said:

would raffia straw work?

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You want to create an environment that encourages this...



The past 3 nights one of the 6 Idolo in that cage has dropped down to the vine to molt.



All I did was cut the fake vine, bend the ends and attached one side using a large safety pin through the side of the net cage. The ceiling has twigs glued to two wooden dowels, also attached with safety pins. Very simple and effective. I don't suggest using a net cage unless you will be around to mist frequently. I also run a humidifier at night that brings the room up to about 50%.

The nymphs will be moved to a glass Exo-Terra for next molt.

That's probably the most economical way I can imagine right now to approach an Idolo enclosure (kudos).

You could probably even sit it in a tin pan with about 1/8" of water, for goodness sake! For that matter, use the whole net cage as the lid for your heated aquarium.

And because I'm still pushing people to try the carpet liner, I'd say you can probably just SEW it right into the net fabric.

The only thing I'd suggest, is to make sure any fake plants have enough texture for gripping - the waxy kind are a wee bit riskier.

And, remember, as someone (Peter?) showed in another thread, you can HANG netcubes - freeing up a lot of space.

gripen said:

The twigs on the top of the cage are too big. They will have trouble moulting from them.

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Oh noooooo!!!! U guys dont like my lid sticks

Okay, I will wank them all off and do it over again!! <_<

They LOVE the foam carpet liner and I cant get them off of the side walls!!

I even have a lamp on top to attract them to the top.

Why cant I just use it on the ceiling too and forget glueing more sticks?

I can just have thinner branches inside for them to climb on!?