Empusa mantis

[Felix Hamann]

Yeah, i looked up the [Herkunft] Origin(?) of fasciata and pennata, and saw that they don't live in Poland. Im sorry for writing this, and thanks for correcting(?).

best regards, Felix

 

[macro junkie]

i want i want

 

[Christian]

The specimens seem to belong to fasciata. So it can't be from Spain.

 

[empusapennata]

The specimens seem to belong to fasciata. So it can't be from Spain.

Some recent documents show that it's possible that in Spain we have both fasciata and pennata but pennata were generally more abundant.

look this document

http://www.amigosgalacho.com/caja1/caja2/c...Entomol2001.pdf

Sorry: It's in Spanish language.

Regards

Jose

 

[Felix Hamann]

Wow!

I thought there were much more Mantids in Spain, for example: Rivetina, Pseudoyersinia and, of course, Apteromantis. But the document says there is only: Ameles, Mantis, Iris, Empusa and Perlamantis - is this possible?!

best regards, Felix

 

[empusapennata]

Two pictures of pennata male from the last spring in Spain

for taxonomy and comparison with pics of yen_saw's male.

Best Regards

José

 

[empusapennata]

Wow!I thought there were much more Mantids in Spain, for example: Rivetina, Pseudoyersinia and, of course, Apteromantis. But the document says there is only: Ameles, Mantis, Iris, Empusa and Perlamantis - is this possible?!

best regards, Felix

It's possible because that document is a taxonomic study of a municipality located in the province of Zaragoza, Aragon, Spain.

In Spain (with Canary Islands) »

Amorphoscelididae

Perlamantis alliberti Guerin-Meneville 1843

Empusidae

Empusa pennata (Thunberg 1815)

Empusa fasciata (Brullé, 1836)??

Blepharopsis mendica (Fabricius, 1775) only Canary I.

Hypsicorypha gracilis (Burmeister, 1838) only Canary I.

Mantidae

Ameles africana Bolivar 1914

Ameles assoi (Bolivar 1873)

Ameles decolor (Charpentier 1825)

Ameles picteti (Saussure, 1869)

Ameles spallanzania (Rossi 1792)

Ameles fracilis (Brullé, 1838) Only Canary I.

Ameles Limbata (Brullé, 1838)

Apteromantis aptera (Fuente 1894)

Geomantis larvoides Pantel 1896

Iris oratoria (Linnaeus 1758)

Mantis religiosa (Linnaeus 1758)

Pseudoyersinia paui (Bolivar 1898)

Pseudoyersinia canariensis Chopard 1942 only Canary I.

Pseudoyersinia betancuriae (Wiemers, 1993) only Canary I

Pseudoyersinia pilipes (Chopard, 1954) only Canary I.

Pseudoyersinia subaptera (Chopard, 1942) only Canary I

Pseudoyersinia teydeana (Chopard, 1942) only Canary I.

Rivetina baetica (Rambur 1838)

Sphodromantis viridis (Forskal 1775)

Regards

 

[Christian]

That document just summerizes the insects found during that study, as far as I understood it. So not all species naturally occurring in Spain are listed. However, I doubt the identification of Empusa fasciata in Spain. It's more likely the specimen(s) were confounded with E. pennata. Some names are wrongly spelled, as Ameles spallanziana, which has to be A. spallanzania. Further, no evidence whatsoever is given to confirm E. fasciata. I'm still convinced that E. pennata is the only W-European species of this genus.

 

[empusapennata]

That document just summerizes the insects found during that study, as far as I understood it. So not all species naturally occurring in Spain are listed. However, I doubt the identification of Empusa fasciata in Spain. It's more likely the specimen(s) were confounded with E. pennata. Some names are wrongly spelled, as Ameles spallanziana, which has to be A. spallanzania. Further, no evidence whatsoever is given to confirm E. fasciata. I'm still convinced that E. pennata is the only W-European species of this genus.

I do agree with you on the point that in Spain. Now we've only Empusa pennata nor Kaltenbach A. Bolivar, I. or Morales Agacino has any

possible occurrence in Periodical Literature but this is not the first time that species have moved in response to climate or ecological change.

And always is time for a possible First record or confirmation of the occurrence.

Best Regards

 

[Christian]

Of course, but it has to be foolproof - say a deposited specimen and/or a photo showing the diagnostic characters of the specimen found. There are a lot of papers with ID faults in it. It's difficult to determine if a species list published somewhere is correct. There are not many real mantid experts, so a lot of mis-IDs occur. All in all a difficult situation.

 

[Morpheus uk]

Luckily enough someone else went to spain and found some more empusa and is letting me breed em, hope i dont scew it up though

 

[yen_saw]

I don't trust the words of your trader --> again: fasciata.Good Luck with them.

best regards, Felix

We are totally relying on the information from European traders for mantis from Europe, as a hobbyist i don't know why if he would want to give us a wrong information which Kamil appear to be very certain. Well, at least the species is identified.

i want i want

Start packing your backpack and travel to Spain this coming Summer MJ, Morpheus might be able to join you YOu are lucky don't have to travel across the ATlantic ocean to find this species

Two pictures of pennata male from the last spring in Spain

for taxonomy and comparison with pics of yen_saw's male.

Best Regards

José

Thanks José, those are beautiful pics of your E. pennata.

 

[Morpheus uk]

Dunno what mine are, they came from alicante spain, though not sure about the other 2,

 

[yen_saw]

Dunno what mine are, they came from alicante spain, though not sure about the other 2,

If your empusa is large enough to observe the lobes, you can tell which species, check the chart attached previously for details. However, both E. pennicornis and E. pennata lobes are quite similar.

One of my female E. fasciata finally molted into adult, what a long wait! i can only hope the month + old male can live long enough to mate.

 

[Morpheus uk]

Coinky dink, was just reading about thses, seem to be ticky to rear hope it all goes well for you and me, btw just now i read that males are ready to mate in 4 day! seems tofast,

 

[Morpheus uk]

Mine where DOA

 

[yen_saw]

Coinky dink, was just reading about thses, seem to be ticky to rear hope it all goes well for you and me, btw just now i read that males are ready to mate in 4 day! seems tofast,

For me the tricky part was optimum diapause requirement. Best of luck to yours. My female is merely a week old but i am sure the 6-week old male are ready for sure.

Mine where DOA

I thought you have some readily available with you?

 

[yen_saw]

Is it possible for the female to deposit an ooth just a week as adult??? I have a large net cage prepared for them, and put 2 males and the female together 2 days ago. I didn't witness mating but i was not looking at all. Could it be that the male mated with the female which accerelate or induce the process of ooth laying?!?! I have the chance to check the cage for the first time in 2 days and there is an ooth next to the adult female :blink: ANyone with the experience with Empusa species please shed some lights here i would like to make sure the second female won't lay ootheca too soon unmated. I will take a pic of that ooth when I got the chance.

 

[Kruszakus]

Yeah, mating always accelerates the process of depositing ooths - in my case, most females of various species held on for a couple of weeks, even if power-fed and kept at high temperatures. Then, after mating - sometimes even a few hours after - they were laying their first ooths.

For example - I let my O. Distinctus eat zounds of crickets and wax moths for ten days or so, and then I introduced the male to her - it was around midnight. The next morning I checked on them, and the female had deposited her first ooth - and it was fertile.

My other Empusidae have been adult for about two weeks - no ooths so far, even though they have a nearly constant supply of food - so I'd wager the possibility, that your ooth may be fertile.

 

[Morpheus uk]

Some one else just went on holiday and found 2 so gave em to me to breed