Idolomantis Consolidated

[Precarious]

Has anyone seen this before...?

I had a damaged pre-sub last time around missing a few legs that successfully molted to sub. Everything seemed to be going well. Then a month later she hung limp, her bowels emptied over a few days and finally she just died. No idea why it happened but she had eaten a cricket the day before. Not sure if that had anything to do with it.

 

[sporeworld]

Hmmm. I know she hasn't eaten anything yet.

I'll keep looking for clues...

 

[angelofdeathzz]

Was her mouth or head unusually dark, and raptors hanging down lower than normal?

 

[sporeworld]

I've tried to update the caresheet at the beginning of this thread. If anyone has notes to add to it, please chime in.

Once thing I added was about L1-L2 feeding. I'm convinced that it's far better to just feed them lots of Hydei. The House Flies and (for L2's) Blue Bottles cause too much stress, and frequently knock them from their perches. Whatever nutrition may be gained, isn't worth the risk. So, my advice to new breeders is to stick to Hydei - cheaper, easier, and safer. I did about 30 nymphs like this, that are now L4, and are doing fine.

Under debate still is L1-L2 enclosures. I have done well with glass aquariums, and can keep the humidity higher, but I think I'd still suggest people use a 12" net cube (I know, out of character for me). Less chance of cannibalism (they can always see it coming), and very easy to see, chase and catch prey. Nothing to get stuck on, or in. Some risk of side-molting,but if kept humid, probably minimal losses. Never seen mold or mildew in my net cages, but it's a constant battle in my aquariums.

Thoughts...?

 

[sporeworld]

Was her mouth or head unusually dark, and raptors hanging down lower than normal?

No dark areas anywhere, just body-wide lethargy. I picked her up by her wings, and everything just sort of sagged.

I got her to mouth some banana, but there was no zeal in it.

 

[angelofdeathzz]

Sorry to hear that, hope it's just a random case and a one time thing. I was asking(the above) to see if it was the same as when we both had a random death and they held there raptors over there head kind of like a molt to come or a headache type look?

You can keep FF's in a net cage? I used 80oz deli's with cloth lid at L1 for a day or two to feed them FF's then switched to house flies with a screen lids still at L1(10-12 nypmhs per deli) with good resualts compared to the cloth lid and only FF's only(many more died), but never gave BB's till L3-4 as they are to big and could knock them down plus they waste alot and only eat part of the BB's and throw the rest down.

 

[sporeworld]

...I was asking(the above) to see if it was the same as when we both had a random death and they held there raptors over there head kind of like a molt to come or a headache type look?

Yeah. If it IS that, it happened WAY quicker than I've seen, and would DIS-prove my theory that it is pre-molt related. This happened within 12 hours.

You can keep FF's in a net cage?

For sure! I'm talking about the Monarch Castles, or Butterfly Cubes, or whatever they're called - the white, tight mesh ones, with the one clear plastic side. Nothing gets out, (or in) as long as the zipper is up tight. Even wild fruit flies can't get IN. I've used them with a wad of moss in the center, or a smudge of fruit fly medium for the ff's.

Edit: You can find them at: http://www.livemonarch.com/castle.htm

 

[sporeworld]

Update: I didn't put her in the freezer, yet. But she's long gone. Still no idea why.

On a brighter note, had another male molt to adult. No incidents at all. So, for molting, I'm 7-1-0. Seven molts without incident, one a little mangled, but doing fine, and no losses (from molting, anyway). So far, so good!

 

[sporeworld]

So, I ended up wedging in strips of Pool Noodle one of my Imminent Molt enclosure. Worked out pretty well.

You can see how she used them to steady herself at different stages. She only knocked off ONE of her legs from it's grip, climbing back up. She used the same wing inflation trick as her brothers and sisters.

You can also see her somewhat-mangled sister in the background. Her wings are funky, and she's kinda bent, but she's eating (and pooping) just fine.

 

[sporeworld]

Note: The kinda-mangled girl (Queen Richard), is doing great. Healthy appetite, good color. She's just clumsy and has goofy wings. I'm doubtful she'll attract any males, but who knows.

 

[RevWillie]

Note: The kinda-mangled girl (Queen Richard), is doing great. Healthy appetite, good color. She's just clumsy and has goofy wings. I'm doubtful she'll attract any males, but who knows.

Are the males that picky? Have you thought of trimming off the vertical part of the goofy wings?

 

[sporeworld]

Are the males that picky?

Have you thought of trimming off the vertical part of the goofy wings?

Hahah! I thought about it, but probably not until after the boys have said "not interested". Besides, some of my staff think she's the pretty one! Eye of the beholder, and all that.

Does kind of look like a cape...

 

[sporeworld]

... what a nymph.. that makes me giggle because its hard to call these guys nymphs anymore.

Amen! They are beasts!

Two more perfect molts last night. One boy, one girl. Humidity low (about 40%). Not on purpose. Didn't seem to matter. All molted on the top, with some assistance for either fake plants or sponges.

Has anyone noticed their eyes getting kind of reddish before a molt...? Might just be cooincidence.

Also...had my first subadult "Dripping Death", or whatever. Just started "wilting" over the course a few hours. None have ever survived once it starts. This one I touched as soon as I noticed it, and it felt just like it was going to molt - cool and clammy. I'm more convinced it's something to do with molting.

 

[angelofdeathzz]

After a long hard fight against the odds and many a series of ups and downs(mostly up), I'm very happy to report a successful mating with my 19 day adult Female and my oldest male(25+ days), The other three younger males get to sit and watch in a jealous stare, the second oldest male(21 days) was not happy the other got there first and got in the mix, well he tried but the female boxed him away as if to say "excuse me can't you see were busy here".

Most of the shots are through the glass as not to disturb them to much, they mated for 4 hours, he stayed on her and they did it again later that night. In the morning he was off her and no damage or even fighting happened the whole 28 hour duration. I'm ecstatic to say the least!!!

 

[Precarious]

You did it! Congratulations.

 

[sporeworld]

UPDATE: Record now for successful adult molts here in SpongeWorld is 8 males and 4 females. Plus, 1 less-than perfect molting Female (She's doing fine) and one perfect molt Female that died 2 days later for no obvious reason.

All are still living communally, although separated by gender. No other oddities or injuries to report, except 2 males each have one half-formed antenae - possibly from before the molt. Doesn't seem to affect their behavior.

I'm scheduled to introduce the female Thursday night, provided I see her calling.

All this is only 5 days later than predicted on page one of this thread. So, thanks to Precarious, Yen and a number others who shared their numbers with us. Keep the faith!

 

[angelofdeathzz]

Well Photobucket finaily let me post these, had some upload problems last few days? Laid on the 20th so will see about a new adult molt, mate, ooth, hatch time table I think?

Mid lay, I caught her!

The fruits of labor!

Guarding her ooth, she is a bad azz!

 

[mantiscraze]

Can we "domesticate" these so that they are as hardy and easy to care for as budwings? Not in my lifetime?

 

[angelofdeathzz]

@Mantiscraze: No they will never be very easy to raise, but with proper RH and good molting surfaces it can be done. But even still then not all will see adulthood, but their overall beauty and size makes it worth it to try, at least that's how I feel?

These are my favorite mantis by far, 2nd to none!

I will get the people that think they have the right stuff, some of these very soon, the biggest thing that needs to be done is simply keep the Humidity(RH) 70-90%(mainly at night) for easier and proper molting. 2nd is something for their feet to lock into(Sporeworlds grid netting or sticks with the bark still on) once those issues are addressed your chances increase 10 fold. High heat is very low on the list of must do things, 84-88 or so is all they need or want really (till mating).

 

[Precarious]

I will get the people that think they have the right stuff, some of these very soon, the biggest thing that needs to be done is simply keep the Humidity(RH) 70-90%(mainly at night) for easier and proper molting. 2nd is something for their feet to lock into(Sporeworlds grid netting or sticks with the bark still on) once those issues are addressed your chances increase 10 fold. High heat is very low on the list of must do things, 84-88 or so is all they need or want really (till mating).

I would second all of that and add that the key to breeding is having a large culture. That takes a lot of commitment. AND a whole lot of flies. I don't think there is any way around it. Other species you can end up with an adult of each sex and breed the next generation. I see no indication that is possible with Idolo. I don't know anyone who has successfully mated a single male to a single female. If anyone knows otherwise please fill me in.

Also be aware that as adults the only proper gripping surface is branches (or something similarly spaced and textured). I have seen them snag their claws and feet in every type of screen and mesh, including the mesh used in Apogee Reptarium cages. Only the loosest meshes are safe and then they have difficulty feeding on them.