Idolomantis Consolidated

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Also, here's a quick pic of some Idolos taking a large silkmoth (it was almost dead already). All three fought over it before I got the camera out. But sadly, they didn't eat much of it, and just lost interest. :-( Please excuse the fly-spit on the window.

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Alice said:
nice! I like the that netting that you used, it looks very sturdy! where did you get it? :)
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I got it at Jo Ann's Fabric. You need some nice sharp scissors to cut it, or your hands will cramp up. Takes Hot glue really well, too. It's not as naturalistic as the stick ceilings the rest of you fellas came up with (kudos, again). Also, even though it looks spongy, it repels water (for better or worse). I suspect it will help insulate the tank, as well.

If it turns out to be what I stick with for a while, next I'll try painting it, or staining it.

I still have a few other uses for it. I'll update soon.

 
And sorry for calling your sticks ugly or boring... I think they are benchmarks - a place we got to that worked. Big "ups" to y'all for inventing them (and the molting net).

These things are essentially diaramas to me - little art projects. I'm really enjoying the tweaking that I'm doing ON TOP OF the work you guys have already done. So big thanks to all the contributors on this (and many other) topics!

 
angelofdeathzz said:
Oh, you know I'm just joking with you about my ugly sticks, but on a serious note I never see your mantis on the sponges much, do you think they like it or maybe avoid it?
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An excellent question! They all start on the sponges, but eventually (or invariably) end up on the top. That is true in ALMOST all my cages. It is ALWAYS true in my cages with top light heat sources. However, take a look at the picture below:

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This was the result of one night where my office was completely dark... BUT the tanks were warmed with ceramic heat lamps instead. When I came in the next morning, they were all clustered on the glass facing THE LIGHT!!! NOT the HEAT!!! Interestingly, all the FLIES were clustered around the heat lamps. Within about 30 minutes of turning on the top light, all but the one hanging (maybe about to molt) had moved to the top.

So, earlier I said "that is true for ALMOST all my cages". In the tanks where the light was obscured at the top (my version of the stick ceiling was a little too tight) they hung where they felt most comfortable (since the light coming through the front glass was rougly the same everywhere). There seemed to be no necessity to hang from the top.

A cage that sits WAY high on the shelf wasn't getting any direct light or heat at all (wit was about 80f at the ceiling), and the nymphs were scattered throughout the cage.

 
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honestly? when i first started, no water no mist on anything! it was an experiment, and everything even violins survived in the humid san gabriel valley without misting of any kind, only moisture was the inside of there food. Everything survived too, but i figured it was kind torturous to do that, so after about 6months to a year i started misting everything. EUUUURHAbody gets one mist a day =)

 
OK - Let's see how y'all judge the gender on these lil guys (or is it gals?)

BTW, the broken leg in the first pic is compelling reason to de-screen the top of your enclosure before L4. They're little legs get stuck around that size, and can snap off. :-(

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quote: OK - Let's see how y'all judge the gender on these lil guys (or is it gals?)

All those in the pic's are males, except maybe the 3rd pick may be female, it does depend on their instar, some are late bloomers. But I'm fairly confident all are male but the 3rd.

 
angelofdeathzz said:
quote: OK - Let's see how y'all judge the gender on these lil guys (or is it gals?)

All those in the pic's are males, except maybe the 3rd pick may be female, it does depend on their instar, some are late bloomers. But I'm fairly confident all are male but the 3rd.
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I can see that! the difference of the antenna is quite subtle.

 
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Alice said:
they also had all their flowers 60% off... so of course i could not help but to get some! :D
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I did an enclosure with a bunch of the really cheap flowers they had, but be warned - they stain easily. But the nymphs really like moving around on them... (noteL This was before I installed the vinyl mesh on the top. Also, there's a week of fly spit on everything! Yuck!).

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UPDATE: You have until about L4 to use tight screen tops without modifications. The L4/L5 range is where they start losing legs and leg segments in the screen. I didn't have any deaths from it, but I've got 2 L4's in my little infirmary, getting special meals and attention. The last of my (many) cages got the "Nylon Sponge Mesh" upgrade tonight. They seem very "happy" in their new homes...

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This one is simplistic, but the fern-like plant is amazing! It's rigid enough for an L4-L5 molt.

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And here's a nymph (hard to call them that when they're this huge) who waited about 10 seconds after I turned off the lights to start molting. I wish I'd taken a picture earlier, cuz it's SO easy to tell when it's about to happen. They raise their arms a little above their head (well, from their perspective), and do these mini push-ups. I'm sure Precarious has it on video...

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Here are some pics of their tarsus gripping the material. I imagined they hooked around the weave, but they appear to kind of pinch it. Anyone with a better lens than me (and Idolos), please get some closeups. This is the best I can manage...

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Here're are some close-ups...

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Here's a poor quality shot of a nymph just minutes from shedding. With these guys, it's always this pose. Arms slightly above the head, and a droopy kind of posture. Good reference for people new to the species...

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Yeah I always say when I see them like that "this ones got a headache, he's about to molt guy's" :lol: , Great info to bring up and let people know about... ;)

 
sporeworld, have you had very many molts using the new material? I have made my "girl" setup and have had 3 molts to L-6 very nicely, they seem to pinch the netting almost perfectly. I am a little concerned however that they are not hanging from the top like they used to. I know that sounds funny because the purpose of putting it on all the sides was so that they would have good grip all over, but, i am afraid they will try to molt on the sides? my instinct is that they will molt somewhere else, but my head says that they don't do what they are supposed to. any thoughts?

 
Alice said:
my instinct is that they will molt somewhere else, but my head says that they don't do what they are supposed to. any thoughts?
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I hate to be the pessimist, but they will always pick the worst spot. You really have to either be present so you can take action to make sure they get through the later molts, or idiot-proof their enclosure. Enabling them to molt from vertical surfaces is not a good idea. No need to make the walls grippable. So long as you have a means of climbing available on two or more sides you're good. This can be as simple as branches they can reach from the ground or a fake vine snaking up the wall.

I still say glass enclosure with screen covered by twigs or mesh, filled with branches is the way to go. I was present to watch nearly every molt of my girls and I can tell you from direct experience they do not look for a good spot to molt. They just do it wherever. I would imagine in the wild their environment is such that they can successfully molt just about anywhere. Not so in captivity.

Last time I was more concerned with creating an environment that allowed me to shoot clear, close video of the process. The flip side to that formula is I needed to be present to film which enabled me to make up for their bad decisions. This time I may go for functionality instead.

If you are not able to be there each time they molt I suggest you do the same or you are setting yourself up for heartbreak.

 
I'm currently at about 50 out of 50 successful molts on the new material(s). There have been NO, repeat NO mismolts from my L4-L5-L6 in the new enclosures.

Now, it bears mentioning, that I'm using new materialS... plural. As Alice noted (with both twigs or mesh), the light is dimmed, and they tend to spend more time in the middle of the enclosure. One of my enclosure experiments is a fully screened cage with double flouro tube lighting. The mantids spend all their time on the top, where heat and light are much stronger. When I see one drop towards the middle, it is always to molt.

My point of materials-plural, is that the other enclosure elements (wired ferns, sunflowers or sponges) have all proven to be molt-wortyh for these instars (we'll see how they do for the final molt). I'm happy to say, I have the numbers to support these experiments, and enough lag time between the multi-aged nymphs to adjust as needed.

All that said, I think Precarious is correct (albeit, not in the direction I want to go), when he says to eliminate side molting options. If I were to design a single-mantid molting chamber, it'd probably be a small glass enclosure with the nylon mesh top, and a single, angled branch leading to the top (and for side grabbing during the flip. But, as mentioned, I'm trying to engineer an environment where the colony won't need that level of attention, and I can occasionally leave the office for fun and adventure!

I'll keep posting results. If y'all have other suggestions, please chime in. I'm confident we can take these beauties off the list of "Experts Only". They are, as I've mentioned several time, THE most rewarding species I've yet encountered. :)

 
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