New and overwhelming

[ieatroaches]

Hello all,

I joined hoping someone could help me figure out what we have been doing wrong. My son (11 today) has been in love with insects since he was in diapers. He aspires to be an entomologist, and there's nothing he loves more than mantises. 

So far we have had an orchid and a ghost (along with various other mantids he's found in the yard). Both of his babies died before completing a molt. We've done a lot of research, but there is a lot of information out there, much of it conflicting. We made sure to feed both flightless fruit flies, mist daily, and do everything we could to keep them happy and healthy. We were keeping them in a glass tank, with mesh top. Could it be a lack of ventilation? 

Any help would be appreciated. I plan on getting him a mantis soon, possibly another ghost, but I dont think either of us can take finding another little friend gone. 

 

[MantisGirl13]

Welcome to the forum, @ieatroaches! 

Lack of ventilation with almost all species is a killer. What were the temps and RH? Were they housed communally? What Instar were they?

I've been in love with insects my whole life too (I'm 14) and I got so frustrated with my first exotics when they all died due to ventilation and food issues, so I understand the feeling of not being able to figure out what you are doing wrong. 

Orchids are a little more complicated than ghosts, so not great for beginners. 

If you are getting him a new mantis soon, I'd suggest the ghosts, as well as spiny flowers and budwings. If you try for a higher Instar you might have better luck as you get acquainted with the care of mantids. Hope this helped!

- MantisGirl13

 

[ieatroaches]

With the ghost, we kept her around 78. Not sure about the rh, but she was misted daily. We didn't have the two at the same time. It's been a little while, also, so forgive me if I dont remember everything completely. I believe she was an l4 or 5. 

I tried finding a habitat to buy him, and was looking at the one on usmantis, but that site seems to be having issues.

 

[MantisGirl13]

Ok. That sounds like good conditions for a ghost, assuming ventilation wasn't a part of it. Where did you get them?

Which one on usmantis were you thinking about? (link) 

- MantisGirl13

 

[ieatroaches]

https://usmantis.com/products/best-insect-habitat-cage-for-praying-mantis-bug-box-clear-locking?variant=50091982100

Also, both mantises came from usmantis. 

 

[ieatroaches]

This is what he has.

https://www.amazon.com/Exo-Terra-Glass-Natural-Terrarium/dp/B0041P5PBE/ref=pd_lpo_vtph_199_tr_img_2?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=BDHZW73AWTC43ACJ9KMD

 

[hysteresis]

This is what he has.

https://www.amazon.com/Exo-Terra-Glass-Natural-Terrarium/dp/B0041P5PBE/ref=pd_lpo_vtph_199_tr_img_2?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=BDHZW73AWTC43ACJ9KMD

Welcome to the forum!

The nano tall is great for a large species for sure.

I keep young nymphs in far smaller habitats. 32oz deli cups with vented lids:

https://www.panterrapets.com/products/deli-cups-vented-lids

I also have mesh lids for species that require frequent misting, and thus require better ventilation.

The reasoning is simple: smaller habitat = easier for a young nymph to hunt.

I would avoid USMANTIS these days as dude hasn't been fulfilling orders (i've heard).

Online vendors aside (and most are in here anyways), you can buy from the Buy / Sell section. Reviews are posted, etc.

@MantisGirl13 is correct that too much humidity and not enough ventilation is a killer. The nano is amazing for ventilation, it's just REALLY  big for a small nymph. Ghosts are small anyways.

Also, remember that humid isn't the same as wetness.

Hope you keep your son in the hobby. We have two boys - 8 and 6 (almost 7).

They 6 yo was walking around today spending his evening as a mantis.   Near the end, he says to me: "I'm a very tired mantis." 

Thanks for joining us!

 

[MantisGirl13]

I totally agree with everything hysteresis just stated. 

Also, the first link shows a cage that is not suitable for a mantis. It doesn't have enough top ventilation and it has no grip on the top (no mesh) making a molt very hard. 

They 6 yo was walking around today spending his evening as a mantis.   Near the end, he says to me: "I'm a very tired mantis." 

That's hilarious! Little kids have such imaginations. 

- MantisGirl13

 

[hysteresis]

Also, the first link shows a cage that is not suitable for a mantis. It doesn't have enough top ventilation and it has no grip on the top (no mesh) making a molt very hard. 

Snap! I missed that.

@ieatroaches, you can zoom in and see that I kept (at that time) 4 oz and 32 oz cups. For small nymphs, they easily lived hunted and perched in the 4 oz cups. I cut out the tops and hot glued in a fine tulle-like ribbon material that was basically see through, as well as suitable for a small nymph to grab. I used a simple cotton pad, swapped out every two or three days as a substrate. Dollar store cheap.

Once mantises need the hang space at molt, they're also a bit more aggressive in that they'll track a prey item and either position to get it as it comes by, or even waltz on over and take it. Good time for a 32oz.

My nano tall is for my adult venosa female. Shes big and mean. I cant even touch her anymore, without a risk of a pinch or nip.

 

[hysteresis]

If it's aesthetics, and just have one mantis, the exo nano (8x8x8) is a good size.

The price adds up if you're using these fancy enclosures.

 

[MantisGirl13]

@hysteresis, where do you get your 32oz deli cups? Sry for the off topic.

- MantisGirl13

 

[ieatroaches]

I'm just trying to figure out what went wrong, so I can fix it. I know they were able to find prey, as they spent most of their time on the screen top, and the fruit flies would go up there, too. I thought maybe cross ventilation was the issue, but i guess not. We thought about getting a heating pad, but a few people said that was a bad idea. I definitely plan on getting something to monitor humidity this time around. Would he be able to use the nano he has if we set it up right, or is it a lost cause? 

And thank you both for all your help. There's no question of him staying on the hobby, he's got us all in love with mantises. 

 

[ieatroaches]

Also, would it be possible to keep more than one ghost housed communally? He is perfectly happy to give ghosts another go. We all loved the one he had. 

If deli cups are the way to go, we will do that, but I would love to use the nano he has.

 

[MantisGirl13]

If you are willing to feed the ghosts in a separate container you can use the nano for a group of ghosts. Feeding in a separate container is necessary to ensure that all get fed well. Ghosts are my favorite. 

And thank you both for all your help. There's no question of him staying on the hobby, he's got us all in love with mantises.

We are glad to help you! That's great, mantids are awesome creatures for sure!

Let us know if you have any more questions!

- MantisGirl13

 

[ieatroaches]

I found a container I think I can modify to fit his needs. It's a plastic container that held lighters, like you see at gas stations. We are off to hunt for supplies. Anything i should keep in mind, or ideal equipment? I'm planning on picking up an rh and temp meter, do I need lights or other heat sources? I'm determined to do this right.

 

[hysteresis]

Ghosts are fine at 70deg.

Coconut fiber (ecoearth) is excellent substrate. I currently use cotton pads though.

Their needs are simple. Dont overclutter.

Something to allow easy climbing up to their lids. I use plastic fern. All my ghosts like perchng on the fern.

Make sure theres enough projected area (top down) that they dont snag when they molt. Make sure the height is 3 to 4 times its flacid length for molting.

Hydei ff cultures take time to establish so maybe buy two. Theyre typically sold in 32oz cups. Feed off of one, let the other cycle.

Good luck.

 

[MantisGirl13]

And don't forget a screen lid. That will help for a hanging/molting surface and ventilation. 

- MantisGirl13

 

[hibiscusmile]

Welcome!

 

[Bentis]

Welcome to the hobby and be careful not too get too carried away with these little aliens.  They're so addicting!  I wish I could provide you with more information regarding the troubles you're running into but  @MantisGirl13 and @hysteresis basically covered your questions.